Science, Smoking, Healthcare, All Prove Gov’t Can’t be Trusted
by Warner Todd HustonJust sit back and let big daddy government show you the way. The Democrat Party is assuring us that they know better because they have science, educated people, doctors and all that “expertise” in their control. Further more they “care” about us all and they want us to know that they’d never do anything to lead us astray.
If you feel like the con is about to begin, you are right.
Of course, we don’t need mere suspicion to divine that the Democrats are liars. We can look at what government and Democrats have already done in several related areas — science, smoking and healthcare — to prove that this newest attempt to “help” us is based on lies, smoke and mirrors.
Let us begin with science. In two areas we see the failure that Democrats perpetuate even with science as their justification: global warming and healthcare.
We are all by now familiar with the lies that global warming is based upon, as revealed by the scheming to hide failure of the science that went on behind the scenes with the email correspondence of the “scientists” at the University of East Anglia Climatic Research Unit (CRU). The science went from settled “consensus” to “ClimateGate” in only a matter of weeks. Yet governments all across the globe have based their policies on these lies. Total failure.
A second example is healthcare. We are told that government is using only the most proficient science for its healthcare decisions. It’s what’s best, what’s needed and what will keep us healthy. Democrats say they know better. They, apparently even know how to keep us alive. So, let’s take a look at some of the top “scientific” medicine that they are going to include in Obamacare.
Early this month we learned that Obamacare will include such quack medical practices as acupuncture, vitamins, or things like bee-pollen pills.
Were these non-scientific, pseudo medical practices included in Obamacare because science dictated it? No. They were included because of lobbying and/or because some non-medically trained politician that wouldn’t know science from a hole in his head decided to add it to the bill and no one with a lick of sense tried to stop him from doing it. And it isn’t just the new federally mandated program now being debated in Congress that this has happened to. Every state that has a state controlled healthcare plan has these sort of unscientific additions to them.
In fact, this is inevitable. Once politicians get involved in a thing, that thing quickly devolves from logic or science to mere politics. It will always end up as a pay off to who ever has the most cash to donate to the politicians. That’s why they call it politics.
Finally, we can use the smoking controversy as exhibit A in the case against government.
Remember how for decades we’ve been told that the tobacco companies are evil and that they must pay to help us all kick the habit? Remember how the sharks gathered for a financial feeding frenzy, where government was the top shark? Remember also how the tobacco companies got raked over the coals by the legal system and have been paying billions of dollars to governments all across the country ever since? Finally, remember how that money is supposed to be used for stop smoking campaigns, health education, and medical care for folks so stupid as not to have known that smoking was dangerous to their health?
As it happens all that money that the various state governments are greedily vacuuming up from those evil tobacco companies isn’t going for the purpose that government claimed it needed it for. In fact, what little money went to actually help “victims” of tobacco has been steadily going down.
The states are collecting record amounts of revenue from the 1998 tobacco settlement and tobacco taxes, but have cut funding for programs to reduce tobacco use by more than 15 percent in the past year, according to a report released today by a coalition of public health organizations.
Of the $5.1 billion in stolen “revenue” taken in by the states to help these so-called victims of tobacco, only 2.3 percent has been used for the purpose all those government officials so sternly told us that they needed it for. Where did the rest go? To where ever and whatever governments wanted to use it for.
According to the GAO, millions of dollars of tobacco settlement money has been used by the various states for infrastructure, schools, general purpose funds, to shore up budget shortfalls, or for debt service on securitized funds. Employing its penchant as a master of understatements, the GAO said of these wasted funds that the “States are exercising their flexibility to use tobacco settlement payments for a wide variety of activities.” Ya think?
Now let us review. We have government getting caught basing policy on the falsified science of global warming and then trying to cover it up. We have money, lobbying and the whim of untrained politicians influencing what sort of medical procedures government will cover instead of basing those decisions on medical science. And we have punitive government taxation and confiscatory legal decisions to bleed tobacco companies in order to fund anti-smoking healthcare and educational polices but government isn’t using the money for those purposes and is instead spending it on all sorts of policies unrelated to tobacco.
And you want these people to take care of your health?
It would be the height of foolishness to allow government to take over our healthcare with the abomination that is Obamacare. Government has not earned this new right by its careful husbanding of its resources in any other area. They’ve ignored science, ignored medical science, and stolen money from programs meant to help its citizens and instead used those funds for political favors and wild-eyed spending.
America, the facts are in. Government cannot be trusted. Speak up and defeat Obamacare because it truly is your own life you could save.
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103 Comments
Does fortunetelling and talking to the dead covers in the healthcare reform?
Thanks for the article but, I did not need anything or anyone to tell me I could not trust the Government.
I'm not sure, but I can get you a great deal on leeches!
[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Debra, Jamie. Jamie said: RT @Deberra: Yeah the Dems *care* about us #lol » Science, Smoking, Healthcare, All Prove Gov’t Can’t be Trusted http://ow.ly/MHCz #tcot … [...]
Our Founders were correct to limit the size and scope of government for precisely the reasons you outline. Mankind has an unfortunate tendancy to want to control the lives of others.
Sounds like government has a massive smoking habit. And they also use steroids too.
Include Finance and Law in the list. All those 'smart' Ivy league liberal geniuses destroyed our economy and our credit system with toxic debt and are now being payed by our tax dollars, to advise us on how to 'fix' the problem.
Leeches? We have enough politicians as it is.
For an entirely fresh perspective, read more a the link:
"…if the bill for your foolishness shows up in the form of higher taxes on me, then I unwillingly start to care what you do. And, trust me on this, you don’t want me turning my heartless judgmental eye on your foolish lifestyle. Because I’d have no qualms criticizing half the stuff you do.
Do you want that? No. Do I want that? No. And that’s the point. Instituting a single-payer universal health-care system, or even a watered-down version as the government is now proposing, compels me to become a meddlesome busybody in your personal choices. And it will compel you to become a meddlesome busybody in everyone else’s personal choices. It forever douses the beautiful flame of individualism — freedom to act without interference, just so long as you are ready to accept the consequences, whatever they may be.
Cigarette taxes show the ineptness of government. In my state, the state government whines about smokers increasing the burden on healthcare so raise the taxes to try and get people to give it up. However, they earmark the cigarette taxes for children's healthcare and when the tax revenue dries up from smokers quitting, we get told we're hurting the children by quitting. A no-win situation. You quit like they want and you get accused of hurting the children. You don't quit, you get accused of driving up the costs of healthcare.
You are aware that acupuncture has been around in Eastern medicine for centuries, yes?
To categorically dismiss the health and healing benefits of a well document Eastern practice reeks of bigotry.
We have millions of citizens in this country of Eastern origin, who may well have experienced the healing and health benefits of acupuncture in either their native cultures or even here in the states as they attempted to maintain a connection with their native culture.
To deny them the right to treatment is unfair, maybe even unconstitutional.
Why not quit smoking, but elect to pay higher taxes to help children?
You do have the option of paying higher taxes; property taxes and income taxes are just minimums.
If you really care about children, put your money where you mouth is and help them.
It is incredible to think that taxpayer's money should pay the Eastern medicine which has not proven that has cured anything. I didn't know healthcare reform is about cultural sensitivies. What a croak!
I'd prefer to just have government stop taxing the hell out of them. If cigarettes are so evil, then just ban tobacco totally. The problem is that it is a big revenue stream for the government so they won't ban it. They just overtax it, then whine when it does what they say they want it to do which is to reduce the number of people smoking because they are so dependent on the tax money from it.
And as for the "for the children" mantra. It doesn't work on me. If the state government really cared about the children, they would fund the children's healthcare programs out of the millions of dollars of pork money the politicians waste each year rather than raise that money from a "sin" tax.
Stealing my money at the point of a gun and giving it to someone else to use for something as un-scientific as Acupuncture is considered Constitutional to Dave Tallow????
You sir are the ENEMY!
Fair enough.
I hear what you are saying.
You don't care about children's healthcare, it's someone else's problem.
I can accept that. But, remember this when those sickly kid's grow up to be sickly adults and insurance skyrockets.
Whoa. You are running away on a tangent!
My basic point was the same point as many GOP lawmakers and Conservative voters: Freedom of choice for the health care consumer!
I thought that was one of the reason we were against the Government run program; it potentially took away choice, diminished the doctor-patient relationship and put decisions in the hands of disconnected bureaucrats.
I'm on your side here.
What gives with you trampling on freedom of choice????
Gun point? Wow! That's quite an assertion.
Anyway, I thought freedom of choice was one of the reasons we were against healthcare reform, no?
I thought that was one of the reason we were against the Government run program; it potentially took away choice, diminished the doctor-patient relationship and put decisions in the hands of disconnected bureaucrats.
Doesn't that potentially make it constitutional issue?
Or, are you….are you suggesting that government bureaucrats should dictate treatment?
Don't know about you, friend, but around these parts we respect the constitution; we don't trample upon it.
You do not want these people controling your healthcare. We should all have learned by now that governement control of anything always results in less freedom and higher taxes (on the hard working Americans anyway). Where do you think the money to pay for this bill is going to come from? the illegals? the poor? NO, the middle class, the working class (the ones whose unions voted for Obama to begin with) will get screwed again.
You can pay your own acupuncture. You don't need the government to negotiate for you.
I'll pay out of pocket for my healtchare as soon as you start doing it, ok?
G77 need NOT accept anything. They should just watch Western nations commits mass suicide. Anyway according to all self-loathing leftists, the ills of the world came from western greed. Please, drink the kool-aid faster the better.
What constitution are you reading? Mine says nothing about federal government involvment in my health.
There is no US Constitional right to health care……PERIOD
If the Government told me the sun was warm and water was wet I would fact check it anyway.
Thats where my confidence level is, and I am pretty sure most of us on this site are leading indicators and the rest of the country will soon follow.
We need to understand that this health care "reform" is the first step towards Obama's New Fascism. There is a very clever double ruse happening with this administration's efforts. First he campaigned as a moderate. That was the first ruse. Next he offers the APPEARANCE of governing from the far left. This is the SECOND ruse. By doing this he's set up the classic battle between conservatives and liberals. With this he's set up a smoke screen for himself, because while we are busy fighting amongst ourselves, his real, substantive actions, behind closed doors, have have only served to build up international banking interests, global corporatism, and world governmental authority. His actions are not classically liberal, and they're certainly not conservative. They ARE Obama's own Third Way. His goal is to establish a Global Fascist State. Think deeply about this and you'll see that I'm right.
If you don't quite see how "health care" fits this picture, just consider the latest Senate "compromise" bill. It is no compromise at all, it IS and has always been the original goal. First you have a massive expansion of governmental control over the health care industry. Second is the introduction of the totalitarian "insurance mandate." Third is the elimination of any form of a "public option" or "single payer." With this trifecta you have established dictatorial power for the central government, unrestricted market access for the private insurance industry, and a permanent marriage of government and corporate interests over every single citizen. This my friends is fascism. This is the president's double ruse. And if he can get this one thing passed, the next big move will be the global climate treaty. I'll let you chew on just where that will lead.
I think our rallying cry may just become, "Left and Right Unite" to beat back the fascist takeover currently underway.
Surprise the EPA lied about smoking statistics to push the money grab off an emotional issue after the gov. spent our money to build a media blitz about it, just as they are doing about weight and lifestyle ramifications. Its the play one against the other scam. Don't you just hate smokers, they raise your insurance. Don't you just hate obesity, it raises your costs. Gee, maybe they are the ones raising the costs by allowing insurance costs to be raised? If the insurance pools could be controlled by the buyers, then maybe they would insure all and we could live in peace..
Oh, yeah don't you just hate those 300,000 or more car drivers who are injured or killed each year, maybe we should get drivers out of the pool as well?
New insurance questions:
do you smoke, drink soda, watch tv, use a cell phone or drive a car.
You can throw chicken bones, eat crap beetles, or self aphyixiate for all I care, just dont make me watch or ask me to pay for it.
Thats the point dimwit.
Wow! I didn't know I have so much power over leftist leeches who are the one sucking and overwhelming the system.
If we leave the next generation with nothing more than the headline of this post, our country will have a very bright future…
Why not use your own money, ah that's right you don't have any to spare, better to force others to pay for your charitity of choice.
I dont care why a thief steals or what he does with his loot, athe thief part is what we object to.
We know what you are DT, bark all you want little dog, your masters over at media matters have lost control and you know it.
Here's a Novel Idea, how bout the Parents of those kids pay for their healthcare? If parents can't afford to pay for their on healthcare, why have kids yet? My wife and I don't have kids yet because we don't have the means to support them. We love kids, and love them to much we want them to have the best. Until we can provide that, we have CHOSEN not to have them. And don't give me the sad story of the children that are soooo sick their parents can't afford their children's healthcare, because this is an extremely small percentage and we give money and raise money for these particular charities like St. Jude Children's Hospital. Again exercising our freedom of choice, given to us by the Constitution of this great land.
Democratic slogan: Don't be bothered by the facts, trust us, we know best!
You can pay for any treatment you like, just dont come begging at our door, of course you don't beg, you demand, when that doesnt work you threaten, and finally you just take at the point of a gun.
How does it feel knowing that you are promoting economic slavery?
Of course you would say it's for the good of others, but then so was owning blacks pre-civil war, I am sure you would have felt very comfortable in the south.
Some science scares which were wrong
ddt, alar, red dye #2, world famine, ozone hole, acid rain, y2k, bird flu, global cooling….
Now government paid (grant money) scientists want me to believe them about global warming…HA!
Failed ( or broke) government programs.
Social Security, Medicare, Medicade, War on Poverty, War on Drugs, Department of Education, US Postal Service,
AMTRAK, the Department of Energy, the Mustang Ranch….And now you want to take health care…
We have already stipulated that Tallow has a different interpretation of our Constitution.
Another really big one was there ppromotion of the The Theory of Evolution, which caused the removal of Christian thought in our Socializing School System.
"Gun point? Wow! That's quite an assertion."
Really? Don't pay your taxes long enough and see if men or women with guns don't come to collect? What universe do you live in?
There's an old saying in journalism: "If your mother says she loves you, check it out anyway."
Like many other people here, what Climategate has done for me is that it validated once and for all my deep suspicion that it was the biggest load of crap to come down the pike. It's not a stretch, then, to conclude that most of what passes for "science" that originates from a government agency is an utter fraud as well.
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If we had elections today between President Bush and the economically illiterate Hussein, President Bush would win a 3rd term in a landslide.
Not one U.S. senator has been trained in medicine and therefore should have no authority to write or sponsor any portion of a healthcare bill. Would you let a teacher do the job of your dentist? Or let an accountant lead a construction project? Let our friend Congressman Ron Paul (a registered OBGYN) write a healthcare bill and you will see what real healthcare reform is all about!
On Climategate: I have known global warming was a scam since the introduction of LEED (Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design) by the U.S. Green Building Council in 1998. While it does have some good (but rather obvious) cost savings ideas, they are expensive on the front end and they mainly address buildings in dense urban areas and not in rural areas. No one cares if your building is LEED certified anyway. This program only lines the pockets of beaurocrats.
No one is asking you to pay for anything.
I just want to ensure that the new health care bill provides for the continuance of the patient doctor relationship and allows freedom of choice.
Why are you so against that?
LEED I believe is a scam. This was supposed to be gone in a few years but kept going on and on. I guess, they like the money now that keeps coming lining up their pockets. I heard they have backlogged certifying projects and you have to pay a hefty fee upfront.
The county I live in used their tobacco settlement money to refurbish the county justice building.
It was a toss up between that or a new media arts building at the community college.
I think it does in Jersey.
You should check out what they did with second hand smoke study.
The results, when compared to the initial criteria, did not constitute any problem. So they simply rejigged the criteria, ran the data through again, and presto – a crisis.
Dr. Walter E. Williams and Dr. Thomas Sowell have written several times about it. They both contribute to TownHall.com. And they have more brains between them than all of the greater DC area.
When ever the bar tender at my local watering hole goes out to smoke, I always congratulate them on their public service for paying even more taxes.
To deny them the right to treatment is unfair, maybe even unconstitutional.
Forcing me to pay for it is most definitely unconstitutional.
Are you paying attention to what's going on in Washington right now? You, I and every one else is going to pay through the nose for this. They say budget neutral? They are lying. They say only $1.2 trillion? They are lying. No government program in the history of the republic that I've ever heard about has ever come in on or under budget.
Medicare was scored at about $80 billion over the entire life time of the program. This year I believe its over $600 billion.
The package being debated will probably end up over $20 trillion, and that's got to come from some where. And that's where We The People come in.
Specifically, our wallets.
I don't believe anyone here is suggesting it should be outlawed, just not covered by insurance.
Eastern medicines may be very good, but I'm not interested in trying them out, that's my choice. If this thing passes, I'm going to be paying for the coverage, which I will never use. This is one of the primary ways that health care costs are spiraling out of control.
Every time a government (Federal or State) passes a law mandating certain coverage, every one is forced to buy coverage for it. That's increased costs, which always passed on to the consumer, us. Did you know every one in NJ who has health insurance has to buy coverage for aromatherapy?
Give people the freedom to choose what type of coverage they want, and costs will go down.
Or, are you….are you suggesting that government bureaucrats should dictate treatment?
Isn't that exactly what the Senate is debating at this very moment? Exactly what We The People will be allowed to have, thanks to their glorious generosity.
I try to cut Mr. Tallow some slack. He doesn't appear to me to be your common, off the shelf, garden variety of vindictive modern liberal.
Perhaps a bit too much indoctrinated by the left, but in many cases, that is treatable. There are a lot of people who don't really understand the economic concept of insurance, which is basically, risk analysis.
There's a reason convicted drunk drivers pay more for auto insurance, and that's because they are a greater risk of repeating that crime. There fore its more risky to the insurance company, so the cost goes up.
When you're raised in an environment surrounded with self righteous indignation, that's what you know.
Education is the key.
I WAS BORN IN A FREE COUNTRY AND BY GOD'S GRACE I WILL DIE FIGHTING TO STAY FREE
LIBERALS BE DAMNED! ENOUGHALREADY!
I've always said the fight is not democrat v. republican or liberal v. conservative.
It's We The People v. the ruling elite.
I've always thought it was "Thank you, thank you, I've dedicated my entire life to public service ([under breath to aid] get that ass hat out of here, now!)"
Hmmm, if I had even two brain cells left to rub together, I'd say I think I see a pattern there.
Maybe he is a misguided gullible one?
One thing I will say for you Dave is that you either play dumb as well as any marxist can, or you are just plain ignorant.
With out realizing it of course you are correct (suprise!) you are not asking, you and your fellow economic slave holders are as usual demanding a hand out from your betters.
Tax payer funded entitlements get paid for, now wait for it, by TAX PAYERS, a category you are most likley not in so your ignorance is understandable.
Since I AM a tax payer and I will be paying for this, yeah it is coming out of my pocket, and as a bonus IF I dont want the health insurance that they think I should have, well fine for me, or off to jail!
I don't ming bums like you holding your hand out, I just cant stand it when you start moralizing about your theft.
Speaking as a former hard core, left wing, liberal, we are raised (by family, school, friends) that what we know is right, and that's all there is too it. No need to question anything, because we already know we're right.
(It was asking those darn questions that got me into trouble with them. Little did I understand 'Question Authority,' really means shut the hell up and do what we tell you.)
So it could just be he doesn't yet understand how much he doesn't know. I'm willing to have a reasonable, logical debate with him on any subject, to see if penetration is possible. It's amazing how many who consider themselves modern liberals, really aren't, only because they really haven't thought all that much about it.
Separate the wheat from the chaff, the ones who can be reasonable, from the ones that can't, work on those, and ignore the rest.
Trying to debate a real, hard core, modern liberal, is like trying to teach a pig to dance. Wastes your time and annoys the pig.
So, you are saying that health care is not worth paying for?
Hey friend, not split hairs….but you said two things.
Anyway, it's amazing how you have determined my income, net worth and everything you need to know about me just from the fact that I am in favor of freedom of choice.
Wow.
BTW, let's compare W2's sometime and see who spends more out of their paycheck funding 'government entitlements'. Heck, I am married and own a home. We don't even have kids. And I pay $12,000 a year for property taxes which are used to fund the education of other peoples' children. Do you have kids? Does it upset you that people like me who don't still are forced to fund your kids' education? Would you support a bill to make it so that only people with kids paid for education? Didn't think so. You aren't so 'anti-entitlement' when you are the one receiving the benefit, I bet.
No, I did not say that. This issue is purposely being muddled to specifically prevent citizens from understanding what's going on.
Health care and health insurance are not the same things.
Health care costs money, health insurance is a means for mediating the risk of health care costs, in case of emergency.
Its not health insurance that's driving up the cost of health care, health care is driving up the cost of health insurance. And government regulation is what's driving up both.
One of the most common myths of the left is that health insurance providers have monopolies in many states, where there are one of a few insurance companies in the market. Government regulations prevent more competition which would drive down costs.
It's impossible, in a free market, for a monopoly to exist for any real length of time, because some one else will come in and under sell it, taking their customers. The only way to ensure that doesn't happen is to buy off some politicians, and have them pass laws preventing competition. And that's exactly what they've been doing for decades.
Competition is out, insurance companies make a bundle, they pay off the politicians with legal donations. They win, and we pay for it.
I fail to see how more of this corrupt cabal can result in anything other than more of the same.
Again, you assumption that I am un-employed is hysterical.
I favor freedom of choice.
And, as I said, the reality of it is….being in the tax bracket that I am in…I AM THE ONE PAYING FOR YOU AND YOURS. Sure, you pay taxes. But not as much as me. Therefore, I am subsidizing your disposable income by allowing the government to take less out of your paycheck.
Instead of calling me names and slandering me…you should be thanking me.
Again, if you have kids that go to public schools, does it bother you that people that aren't parents are forced to pay taxes to educate your kids?
Or are you only against those taxes which you aren't the direct beneficiary?
Have you gone to a doctor this year? Well, then looks like you are one of the leeches also.
That's quite a leap. Going from me advocating for reasonably priced health care that retains freedom of choice; to economic slavery.
When was the last time someone from the government took money from you at the point of the gun?
I categorically object to that sort of thing.
i) Who asked you to try it out? I think you misunderstood. Nobody said you HAD to get acupuncture.
ii)Makes no sense to pay for it if you aren't going to use it. You owe it to yourself to see a doctor. Don't try to be a hero.
iii) Aromatherapy has proven to clinically reduce stress. Hopefully it will be covered by the new National Health Plan, too.
iv) I agree. Give people the freedom to choose their coverage. As long as they have the option to choose acupuncture.
My daughter attends a private Parochial school (Christmas pageant starts in about an hour, she's in the choir) and I do have to pay do have to pay school taxes or else the government will kick me out of my house and seize it.
Public school funding is one place where I split from my libertarian brethren. Thomas Jefferson makes a very compelling case for it.
"I know no safe depositary of the ultimate powers of the society but the people themselves; and if we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with a wholesome discretion, the remedy is not to take it from them, but to inform their discretion by education. This is the true corrective of abuses of constitutional power." –Thomas Jefferson to William C. Jarvis, 1820. ME 15:278
How ever, that does not mean I agree the federal government should have any say in how local people what to educate their children. I do not believe it should be a monopoly where only those with the means can get out of it. And I'm appalled that students are being held hostage to the whims of the teacher's unions.
Looking at the state of public education (NY State has a 40% drop out rate) can you honestly say the system works?
This is what you always get with government intervention. Bureaucracy, entrenched, never ending spending increases, and increasing failures. Happens pretty much every time. I can think of very few things government does better than the private sector. Military comes to mind. But not much else.
Umm…ok. LOL. So, collecting taxes is stealing?
What universe do you live in?
You are serious? You believe the Palin death panel stuff? Really?
Well, then no. That isn't what the Senate is debating right now. They are debating the best way to expand coverage to those that need it, while at the same time ensuring that those that have coverage don't lose it to mounting costs.
What papers do you read?
Fair point.
But we are talking about health insurance.
i) If the government takes over the health care industry, it won't matter if I want it, I will pay health insurance premiums for it. That's a fact. If the government says its covered, we will pay for it.
ii) Government doesn't care if I want to pay for it. If its in their law, we will pay for it.
iii) Aromatherapy may very well be fine, but I see no reason to force me to pay premiums for it, if I have no intention of using it.
iv) I had a feeling sooner or later we'd find some common ground. That's why I'm engaging you open debate in the arena of free ideas. If this monstrosity passes, there will be no choice in the matter. If the government says its covered, you will pay premiums for it. If it's not, you may not be able to get it at all. In Canada, their Supreme Court ruled people can not go outside the government system for health care. That's why they come to the US for it.
The rules will be written by politicians and the lobbyists who fund them. We The People will have no say in the matter.
My private insurance policy, through my employer, is actually a contract. If they choose not to honor that contract I can take them to court, and make them honor it.
Where do you go when the government is the insurance company?
I'm not a liberal.
I just support health care reform.
And, to your offer to help me understand that which I don't know: I've already treated you to that same offer.
You are incorrect in saying that "Not one U.S. senator has been trained in medicine " .. I did a very quick little search and found one immediately. I would presume there are others, also. I'd also bet if there are any others, they also have an (R) after their name and title, too.
U.S. Senator Tom Coburn, M.D. (R-OK)
Then let's keep it to health insurance, and not confuse the issue with health care. They are separate.
And allow me to thank you for the reasoned, polite, logical debate. I always missed that when I was on the left.
Yes they are. Money is a finite quantity. When need outstrips the amount of money available, there is no alternative to rationing. And when you ration, some get it, some don't. There is no other logical conclusion.
Every one rations. When you get paid do you take a cruise to Hawaii or do you pay your bills, buy your food, and then decide what to do with what you have left?
You are rationing your spending. That's exactly what government does, and that's exactly what they are going to do.
And its already happening.
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/oregon_hea...
If you want to reject this as evidence because of the source, do a google search on the patients name, and you will find plenty of other links.
You may bot be a liberal, but your displaying many of their traits. Excuse the misdiagnosis.
I do understand what's going on, that's why I'm so much against it.
I to want health care reform. And the easiest, most painless method is to end as much government intervention and regulation as possible. Government always drives up costs and creates inefficient bureaucracies.
I'm old enough to remember when I was young going to the hospital for an x-ray on my wrist – bike accident. Total cost $15, my Mom paid it on the spot.
Then government got involved and fixed it. Last year my daughter needed an x-ray because of a sinus inflammation. Total cost over $1,000.
That's some fix, now ain't it?
There is a physician in the senate trying to fight for the people, working very hard to counter the latest BS with the healthcare reform bill. http://coburn.senate.gov/public/
"U.S. Senator Tom Coburn, M.D. (R-OK) released the following statement today after forcing the Clerk of the Senate to read the 767 page Sanders amendment which would establish a single payer, government-run health care system in the United States.
“I admire Senator Sanders for his willingness to fight for publicly what many advocate only privately – a single payer health care system funded and controlled by bureaucrats and politicians in Washington. Every American should listen to the reading of this amendment and pay careful attention to its vote tally,” Dr. Coburn said.
"Dr. Coburn, a practicing physician with 25 years of experience, has introduced a health care reform bill, the Patients’ Choice Act, which, unlike the Sanders amendment and the Reid bill, puts patients, not politicians, at the center of our health care system." Go read the rest!
Why would I reject it because of the source?
What are you insinuating?
Was your daughter ok?
The most disturbing fact of the matter, for me, is that there are people who, while refusing to complete even a cursory investigation of their local school board levy, will "spout off" in no uncertain terms as to importance of passing this bill.
They seem to have not even the slightest grasp of the complexities involved with implementing and financing a program of this magnitude. They continuously fail to observe that every time the government plunges forth with these types of socialistic programs they are actually losing their independence and yes, freedom.
When will these persons recognize that when ever the government endeavors to "care" for us citizens on a "come one, come all" basis they are simply enlarging their power base and decreasing the rights our forefathers risked their lives and livelihoods to protect.
Shame on them for their lackadaisical and high time preference attitude. We can never afford to allow the government to gain this kind of control over our lives. It is wrong and "our" politicians have a moral duty to stop this now.
Zombie comes through again!
Thanks for the tip.
Amen. Wish people would demand a return to the constitutional government that made this country great.
I am against paying for you and yours via my tax dollars.
As if you didnt get it. If you relly don't then you are even dumber than your straw man arguments make you out to be.
You and your fellow wannabe economic slave owners are drawing your last breathes, you just don't see the train coming, but if you listen carefully you can hear the whistle in the distance .
The only thing worse than a low life bum begging for his supper is the same bum complaining when he gets chicken instead of steak, you fools have overplayed your hand and don't even realize it yet.
You fell for the Tobacco Free Kids press release? TFK huge endowment fund thanks to MSA and the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation, even bigger endowment fund. Anti tobacco is a private agenda and needs to be funding with private funds, not tax funding. The states are never going to ban tobacco, so why fund anything that works to decrease their own revenue streams? Health cost savings? When? We have had 30 yrs of anti tobacco, smoking is lower than ever and health care cost are higher than ever. Something doesn't pencil out here.
I should have saved my reply, because it seems Dr.Coburn has been a very busy man- http://coburn.senate.gov/public/
"Dr. Coburn, a practicing physician with 25 years of experience, has introduced a health care reform bill, the Patients’ Choice Act, which, unlike the Sanders amendment and the Reid bill, puts patients, not politicians, at the center of our health care system. Dr. Coburn, along with Senator Richard Burr (R-NC) and Representatives Paul Ryan (R-WI) and Devin Nunes (R-CA), introduced the Patients’ Choice Act in May of this year, six months before the Reid bill was introduced…"
Some senators are listening to a physician, it seems.. just not enough!
Mr. Huston, you disappointed me. You're quick to jump on the "science" of ClimateGate, yet you believed the "science" of secondhand smoke. "Science" is bought when political agendas are involved. http://www.data-yard.net/ets_summary/study_list.h... is a compilaton of SHS/ETS. The danger of SHS/ETS was invented to force people into the cold, to be shunned/outcast to force them to quit smoking. Tobacco-control calls it "denormalizing behaviors". Look to who is financially behind smoking bans & tobacco-control. It's the PROFITABLE, "non" profit of Johnson & Johnson, the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation, created with JnJ stock valued, at last annual report, at $2,824,311,000. J&J owns Nicoderm & Nicorette.
The war on obesity? Started by RWJF (J&J owns Splenda & EthiconEndo bariatric surgery company). They buy laws from which they profit, all the while enjoying tax-exempt status as a "non" profit. CEO William Weldon (J&J) TOOK HOME, last year, 29.4 MILLION DOLLARS. Tobacco-Free Kids, named in your article, was created and funded starting with $84,000,000 by RWJF. Now William Corr (ex-TFK) is an Obama lobbyist appointee to Health & Human Services. RWJF funds studies, polls, etc. including one study that said the source of funding influences the outcome of ETS studies…only, of course, they made the claim against tobacco company funding. What about RWJF funding? They stand to profit!
Let the wealthy non-profits spend their money handing out the "free" gum and patches. It's why they've been given the luxury of being tax-exempt. Get the government out of the business of funding these non-profits and making them wealthier than they already are. Take the ACS. FY ending 2008, they spent just a little over HALF of what their salaries, benefits, pensions amounted to for cancer patient & family support. Let them cut down on some of the hired fundraisers & let them buy the patches & gum (by the way, the patches have a 98.4% FAILURE rate for quitting 1 year or longer and the gum causes high blood pressure, extreme hair loss, skin lesions and is FAR more addictive than cigarettes http://www.askapatient.com/viewrating.asp?drug=18... We need to put SHS/ETS on TRIAL using the Judicial Reference Manual on Scientific Evidence. Their "evidence" wouldn't pass muster. Where's the demand for truth? It shouldn't matter if it's 2nd hand tobacco smoke, the hoax of global warming or anything else. The truth is the truth and we should ALL demand it.
LOL excellent riposte!!
LOL. I love how you Libs come across. Because I don't want to fork over more of my hard earned money because some Lib politician says I should it means I hate children…
I have news for you Dave Tallow, I have three children. I just don't think it's my responsibility to have to pay for the care of other people's children. That's what charities are there for (and I do donate to various charities which aren't headed by a bunch of raving Libs). I also don't think it's anyone else's responsibility to pay for my children besides me. You Libs just can't understand that since you guys are so busy trying to abort our future generation as well as saddle the future generation that manages to survive the attempt with massive debt just so you can "feel good about yourself" now.
Yes she was, thanks for asking. She started with a head cold, then felt better so she stopped worrying about it, turned into an inflammation, and then an infection.
The Dr. scared her enough where she stayed on the medication till it was completely cleared up. Her mother does the same thing. As soon as she starts feeling a little better, she stops taking medicine.
Women. Can't live with them, pass the beer nuts.
I have had many on-line debates, with many people, and when I cite sources, people have attempted to shoot me down based on nothing more than the URL google came up with first.
Meant no disrespect, only if you were an atheist, I didn't want you coming back saying the story was false, because it was from the Catholic news agency, and they're biased.
I've had people tell me if something was printed in the Wall Street Journal, it didn't really happen. Was in a hurry, so I grabbed the first solid link google returned.
Can I ask you – what is your definition of a 'right'?
ClimateGate, obesity, sugar, etc. are all out of the playbook from tobacco-control. The drastic drop in heart attack hospital admissions studies have been busted like ClimateGate, yet no one prints a retraction. In fact, RWJF, the ACS, etc. keep telling the lie because tobacco has been demonized and anyone who wants to expose what's really going on gets ostracized. Many doctors HAVE been because they're upset that when their studies don't "prove" what tobacco-control wants proven, the doctors & scients have been provessionally ruined and outcast by their peers. You, Mr. Huston, fell for the rhetoric hook, line and sinker. I hope you don't like a beer or are 5 lbs. overweight. They come for you, next.
The leap is about 2mm, which for you might be the grand canyon, but lets review your ideology shall we?
Redistribution requires coercion as you well know Mr. Shallow
Pay taxes or go to jail, you don't want to go to jail then out comes the gun. Pretty simple.
Now all taxes are not redistributions and few here are against all taxes.
What you and you ilk wants is nothing short of forcibly taking from one to give to another based on whatever your motivation of the moment is.
How much you take is dependent on the persons means, how much to give is based on the persons needs. If the person with means refuses to give you just put the hand on the whip at first, but you no problem using it either.
Now where have we heard that ideology before, ah yes Mao, Stalin, etc. How many million died under that system of "Economic Justice"
We know who you are, and we are going to finish your evil off this time, you have overplayed your hand and soon, very soon it's time to pay.
He is the enemy and he knows it.
I love leftist trolls if for no other reason that people will get used to how they operate
To categorically dismiss the health and healing benefits of a well document Eastern practice reeks of bigotry.
That comment reeks of idiocy and buffoonery as well as down right stupidity. I am sick of idiotic liberal socialist pieces
of crap who accuse everyone who disagrees with them of being a bigot. Get a clue pal.
Smoking became an issue because it became a revenue source. Funny NYC lost over $35 million from revenue due to the smoking ban from business who lost income and over $25 million from lost wage revenue from people losing their jobs. But there was no lost income from the ban. Again the statistic resource was from those places that could increase pricing to make up for lost income. Those places that couldn't just went out of business.
States have now become tobacco pushers, demanding sales only from their state as to not loss taxes.
Our morning newpaper had a big article on the anti tobacco folks insisting that tobacco cessation drugs be included in the health plan bill. I guess that explains why the Director of the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation is right behing the dude from the S.E.I.U. in the number of White House visits. J & J stands to reap more billions in sales of nicotine replacement drugs to the government funded health plans.
The players are lined up to line their pockets at the expense of the taxpayer.
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