Now, I Definitely Want A Job In Government
by Veronique de RugyStudy this USA Today chart and cry:
According to USA Today:
“Overall, federal workers earned an average salary of $67,691 in 2008 for occupations that exist both in government and the private sector, according to Bureau of Labor Statistics data. The average pay for the same mix of jobs in the private sector was $60,046 in 2008, the most recent data available.”
And let’s just add insult to injury:
“These salary figures do not include the value of health, pension and other benefits, which averaged $40,785 per federal employee in 2008 vs. $9,882 per private worker, according to the Bureau of Economic Analysis.”
So now when you put your kids to bed and they tell you that when they grow up they want to be a doctor and a veterinarian, your answer should be: “Honey, these are all great choices, but what you really want to be is a bureaucrat.”
Here and here are more arguments to convince your little ones.
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436 Comments
Liberal world view:
Government SEIU employees, good Americans…
Private non union business owners and the people that work for them, infidels..
Any questions?
This is all well and good, they make so much more and then they get this awesome pension (I know, I have an aunt that worked in the employment area of Federal Government she retired at 55 with a full pension, went back to school got her PHD and is making her pension and a buttload more money with her PHD) the downside is: Look at Greece. The piper has come back and needs to be paid and there are no funds to pay him. I think my aunt's situation is nice for her because she's on the receiving end of it, I think it sucks for me because the first 48 cents of every dollar I earn is going toward federal taxes. What happens to all these employees when the government runs out of money to pay them or worse prints money to pay them, then $68K a year isn't going to buy you squat. Right now in California $68K is less than middle class, it will buy you a very modest home, the other part of your life you have to finance on a credit card.
Clergy? WTH! Is Rev. Wright on staff?
And Jesse, Al and Louis?
We are heading the way of Greece…The Pied Piper is on his way. Pray that "We the people" will have control over the restructuring.
I forgot them…they have been locked in a closet of late…
But with those higher salaries we get the cream of the crop. I'm sorry…I meant scum off the top.
Most government workers I know would have a damn difficult time getting a job in the private sector.
These are definitely hand-picked occupations for shock effect. I'm a computer Scientist making $92,000. Private sector with same experience makes about $113,000. You'll find Aerospace and Mechanical Engineers are pretty much in the same boat we me. It's been my experience that there are too many managers and they probably are overpaid. If you remove the DC bureaucrats from the mix of all Feds we probably average what the private sector makes. Let's be realistic here folks. USA Today isn't exactly an unbiased paper you know..
The outlier (Airline pilots) is that way because you get training from the government (military) in exchange for x years of service. So, that one fits right in with the government using our money to pay more than a job is worth in the rest of the country.
Interesting. They don't pay editors a lot. Don't want anybody to fact check them I guess.
Just to add insult to injury, Fed Jobs are easier by far than those in the private sector. I just recently became employeed with the Fed govt after years in the private sector as an engineer. Unfortunately with the economy where it is the civil engr career field is pretty bad and this was all that I could find. The family's got to eat so I took it. (Makes me sick, but sometimes a man just has to suck it up. Hopefully I will find something and move back to private sector work ASAP.) For me the salary was the same as my previous private sector job, but the work load is not even close. The sad part is that "long time" fed employees think that this is a high stress difficult work environment. I just have to laugh. Here I have no product to sell, no real deadlines, no customers, etc.
(cont) Yes, I have people that I work with and that I have to respond to, but it is nothing like having paying customers who have expectations for you to complete a project and a design on time and within budget. The job that our office does with 30+ people working on the taxpayers dollar could easily be done by about 8-10 of the guys that I used to work with in the private sector who were actually productive. This doesn't even take into account the fact that the fed office/section that I work for probably shouldn't even exist Constitutionally. Our Fed govt is broken beyond belief.
Where did they get $40K per employee for benefits? I'm a Federal employee (making about $20K less than the average for a person with my education and experience) and the total benefits I know about add up to about $15K per year (health insurance supplement (we still have to buy it), matching savings plan contribution, and retirement account contribution) I would personally like to know where the other $25K is.
This is not at all surprising. I saw an article the other day on the richest counties in the U.S. and the top three were around Washington DC. People are working for the government and relative to the rest of us, getting rich. On top of the salaries, they get an incredible pension that we pay for even after they quite. The pension is huge too.
The U.K has the highest government employment in the world…is this what people really want as 'jobs'..to be tied to the government!!!????
But you do need to be able to pass a drug screening and have no criminal convictions.
I've had to do that at every private sector job I've ever had too and actually I never had a drug test before becoming a Fed employee. They did do a crimanal background check.
I didn't see "lawyer" on the list. I think that could make up for ALL the other differences, right there. Government lawyers earn very little, compared to what they could make in the private sector.
God I'm glad I never went into government IT work – I love the private sector!
(see Computer Support Specialist)
Seems you have backtracked a bit now that you are starting to make reasonable comparisons. You forgot the career of armed thug. Compare a military grunt with a Blackwater (Xe) employee. Why don't you do that?
BTW, factor out the ILLEGAL ALIENS that the private sector has hired so many of (in their greedy pursuit of money). How do you think that might affect the "Landscape architect" disparity, hmmmmmmm?
Just face it – you tried to create an issue where there was none. You are a CFR/AEI stooge and your goal, as is theirs, is to destroy the Middle Class.
One of your articles published in CFR.
http://www.cfr.org/publication/10038/aei.html
Folks – these are the very elites that are destroying the GOP. The McCain types who don't know how many homes they own and are amazed at the laser scanners at the grocery store checkout.
So now when you put your kids to bed and they tell you that when they grow up they want to be a doctor and a veterinarian, your answer should be: “Honey, these are all great choices, but what you really want to be is a bureaucrat.”
Most of those you listed were technical positions. So, the graphics designers that work for the government are suddenly bureaucrats? YOU are more of a bureaucrat than they are! How much do you get from AEI and CFR – do you get two checks or just one?
Bob, why don't you go to the private sector then? Is it the allure of the great pension? Unfortunately or fortunately there may not be funding for these pensions 10 years down the road.
If you have been paying attention, and it LOOKS like that you aren't, these government jobs are for Blacks, not whites!
This is not about race, it's about fact!
If you read the telegraph today it will explain the mess the British government is in right now. Their piper is coming home for payment as well, not only that, Parliament is demanding the closure of coal fired electricity plants and citizens are going to be funding new 'eco friendly' plants on their current electric bill. I think the subjects of England are getting a little restless. They did hold their first 'Tea Party' not too long ago. When a welfare recipient is living better than a working tax payer the system is not working, it's a mess.
No USA Today isn't unbiased, they usually shill for the guvment. Since the are government shills it's probably much worse. The state of Alabama is in the adult beverages business, the guy who puts liquor bottles on the shelf makes in excess of $30,000/yr + government benefits. Sheesh.
When there is no bottom line to be concerned about for stockholders. When currying union endorsements and re-election is the goal, bribery through paycheck is an easy solution. This is re-disdribution under the cover of "employment".
re-distribution…..sorry about that.
The author of this piece has connections to CFR, American Enterprise Institute and a slew of other anti-American organizations. Her task is to get the Middle Class set against each other.
This is how you kill a country! When the Gov gets bigger than the people that support it, it will collapse!!! You just watch!
This has all been planned out, then the N.W.O. can come on in and take over!
This does not take into account the even greater disparity in many states ( California) between state and local jobs and private sector ( including all benefits). And, unlike Greece the federal government is on the hook for these underfunded state pensions, and its estimated at almost $3 trillion if you ignore the aggressive accounting assumptions on liabilities. The reason Moody's has misgivings about US AAA debt rating is because it recognizes the fed and every taxpayer is on the hook for these profligate states, who are largely controlled by public sector unions.
I feel sorry for you. You think you are going to be part of the ruling elite and everyone else will be serfs. What is worse is you seem to want that. That is the CFR vision of the world – these people resent the Middle Class and want a return to the feudal system.
That is true. There are a lot of inept Blacks occupying these positions. Attack Affirmative Action that put them there – not those who are doing their job, though.
Everyone should remember this author – rarely have I seen such brazen attempts to spread lies and set the Middle Class against one another. She is a typical CFR-type.
When you stop and think about ALL the criminal element that are currently in this administration…you have to wonder!
Hope you get to keep it – don't let Bill Gates know.
3, but your point is definitely still valid.
To quote Ghostbusters:
"I've been in the private sector. They expect *results*!"
Good point. This author had a propaganda-point to make and has been feverishly trying to find facts to support it (and failed repeatedly as people reveal their own experiences that contradict it and her curious math).
Add to that the gov't jobs whose ratio to the business world is effectively that of $X to Zero. I spent two summers during school in State gov't jobs. There were effectively no duties. There was nothing really to do except, maybe, answer internal emails (about trivia) and process two pieces of paper a day (internal, of course). Most of the other people in the office likewise had nothing meaningful to do, and most cubicles were empty the majority of the time. But the organizational chart said those jobs had to exist, and they were funded, so, dammit, warm bodies would fill them!
There's a nasty cycle going on here- public-employee union dues extracted, to fund the campaigns of big-government politicians, who expand the number of public employees, whose dues feed the unions….
Just curious are these salaries at the top of the GS scales?? I know a few fed workers and as a GS-12 step 10 with a Denver locality pay they make about $85K as computer specialists at a HQ level. A step 10 is as far as you can get without going to a GS-13 and only get whatever cost of living allowances they get.
I was not hired at a Big-Name auto parts store over not being able to speak Spanish…the girl they hired didn't know the difference between her head and a headlight bulb..but she spoke Spanish..I was discrminated against…nevermind that I had over 2 years of parts-store experience at that time (now its over 5 years). There's no NAACP for us average white guys…there's no average white guy history month…there's no all-white colleges (but there's Grambling, an all-black school)…there's no CBC for the white guys in politics…there's no National Black Journalist Assoc. for white guys…because all that would be "racist"…I'm sick of it.. I'm sure people will brand me as "racist", but I am not. I'm just observant…and tired of our PC culture..
*discriminated* (batteries are running low on the wireless keyboard)
Ahh…
Ahmed the "dead terrorist", I love that shtick!
Very funny stuff!
Joey,…. let me ask you one question,……. since you feel this article is somewhat skewed……..
Would you rather be in hot water on your job in the private sector or the public sector…..
"Middle Class against one another",……maybe Randy its more like,…..
the Middle Class waking up to the mistake they made in 2008.
Time to start firing federal employees. We in the private sector cannot afford them. We must have a right not to financially support others, don't we? Are these federal employees our children? I am pissed.
Everyone I know in the private sector work force received either a pay cut or a pink slip,…. now………
everyone I know that works for the government,….well……all they talk about is……
how they are going to go from G3 to G4,…….. right on schedule.
It reports that out of 180 occupations, private pays higher in 36. Couple that with benefits and it's not exactly the picture of "working for the government means lower wages" crap we usually get.
Out of 180 occupations, 36 are higher paid in the private sector. That's 80% of government jobs are paid more than private sector!
I did some checking on this the other day when USA Today published it. It turns out the information being quoted here is from a survey called the Occupational Employment Statistics Survey (http://www.bls.gov/oes/). Just one problem. BLS apparently depends on the person sending the information to understand the rules (http://www.bls.gov/soc/socguide.htm), which include things like supervisors being lumped in with their employees. Does BLS check to make sure private companies follow the rules?
Ruling class…you mean King Obama?
Yes – Military Chaplains….. and yes – they get sent to the front and perform services in the field with the soldiers.
The Military Chaplains do deserve that pay…sorry I was being a smart ass. It was a joke!
My Salary is going to be off by at least 20k this coming year so I want to know when the feds are going to take a 25% pay cut. For the huf po trolls I make under 100k a year so it not like I am some rich banker no I am actually middle class.
Hey why don't you enjoy your time and prepare to rock the boat on the way out. If you see any corruption take note film it etc. You could be a hero star kinda like a future politician trying to help a hooker in an undercover acorn video That goes for any other freedom loving american currently employed by a government agency.
.
I talked to a friend of mine who is a G-15 with the Post office. He said they had a whole culture built up within the post office to take of their people. Counselors, racial investigators, realtors, financial people, doctors on staff, nurses, and on and on– just for them.
They moved him 30 miles south to San Jose, CA, one time and they bought his former house from him at top dollar so he could move. Just 2 years later, they moved him back and bought his other house from him again at top dollar so he could move the second time. He made a huge profit each time. Of course, we paid for his houses.
He never asked for such things, but he got paid the gains on both houses at taxpayers expense. Happens all the time.
.
Lorben,
You are a gracious person.
While completing my undergrad, I worked at a military research lab on a base. Contained therein was a cafeteria. I brown bagged it, but went in line to purchase a soft drink. I grabbed a plastic spoon, so that I may enjoy my yogurt without resorting to using my fingers. The cashier had the audacity to give me a hard time, implying that I was stealing the spoon. She mocked me by acting as if I pretended to need it for my beverage. We've all dealt with service personnel who are clueless, rude, or just plain dumb, but I'd never before or since encounter such a level of self-righteous animus. Anyone who imagines this attitude is not the result of such people being backed-up by all-powerful unions is living in la-la land.
You and I, who are doing the same jobs, are paying these people more money. Does that seem rational to you?
How much correlation is there between these stupid pay rates and the fact that a majority of government positions are unionized?
They must be counting the Military Dental Assistants, Clergy, Cooks, etc…. They are probably factoring in Military non-taxable benefits such as BAH(basic allowance for housing) and BAS(basic allowance for subsistence).
The value of your pension I assume…future value of that is unbelievably higher.
Why does the government employ half of these people? Shouldn't a lot of these jobs be contracted out?
Contract labor is just another attack on the Middle Class. If anything, the government should be employing people to build roads directly. Adding some low-bid contractor that cuts corners results in a shoddy road. Employ people who will be there long term and have a stake in the project. Let's compare our roads (a joke among developed societies) with the Autobahn
I don't know of any government positions that are unionized.
He is a CFR-groomed candidate, yes. What about it?
Good. Only thing holding the Middle Class together right now. Go ask Gates about his view there is a "shorage" of American workers so he can get more H1B slaves in the country. But don't attack the remaining Middle Class.
I can't help your ignorance. Public Sector Unions are any that represent employess hired by federal, state, or local governments. When the NY transit workers go on strike, that union is a public sector union; those workers are employed by the government at the local level.
If government was so efficient and effective at getting things done, the Twin Towers would be rebuilt by now. That they aren't speaks to the bureaucratic mess governing the process. I seriously don't want my roads managed by the same process. Private industry gets it done faster and more efficiently because they don't have endless amounts of taxpayer dollars to waste.
"It is the foreign element that commits our crimes. There is no native criminal class except Congress."-Mark Twain
You forgot politican, where the real money is. Who says crime doesn't pay?
Just wondering what the Government pays Brian Williams, Katy Kouric, Anderson Cooper, Keith Olberman, etc as compared to a real journalist.
that certainly puts us a lot closer to 45 than the 15
Some one has to keep their bloodsucking, taxpayer sucking fangs sharp!
I'll tell you what I would do in regards to the earnings disparity – freeze all government positions pay increase until on par (including benefits) with private sector counterparts, at which time they should be tied to cost-of-living and thereafter raises set so as not to exceed private sector wages by more than 5%.
Double time? That's a good one Max!
One day Randy you will learn to read and understand what you read.
This post is not nor are the comments against the middle class,… what all of us are,… I presume.
It is the shift in the middle class job market from the private to the public sector that is being discussed as well as the shift in the pay scales fore these sections.
If you feel that a strong national economy is one where the majority of the MIDDLE CLASS works for the government. well then I sorry,…… I don't what you and Bill Gates thinks,…. but you are both wrong.
Only Federal employees hired before 1984 have a significant pension. Those who began later, like me, have a meager retirement plan that is 1/3 social security, 1/3 personal savings plan, 1/3 federal retirement plan.
I would cut wages on most of them…not all (military would be untouched) and take away their fat cat retirements and healthcare…they can live on SSI, Medicare, and Medicaid like the rest of us. But honestly SSI, Medicare and Medicaid is not going to be there at all when the system collapses in less than two years…so its all a pipe dreams.
Yeah, I don't think you can cut wages and I wouldn't include military or hazardous professions such as fire/police/rescue.
It irks me that government workers seems to think they're immune from financial downturns.
All this whining misses the fact that government employees pay taxes too!! You have the same opportunities we did. Quit complaining and whining!
Why not include the military?
They are immune to upturns, too. Their wages were much lower during the last "boom." I still don't believe they are paid more than the private sector – this author has cited sketchy info several times before trying to float this idea.
Well, I WAS making just over $40K until my position was cut last August and now I took a temp job for eight weeks less a third of the salary I was making!! My hopes were work temp to hire. Guess what? That isn't going to happen because they are posting most of the jobs as contract workers so no benefits. This is a LARGE medical company about to celebrate a 50 year anniversary.
Well, I wouldn't trust all these numbers because right off the bat, the "average" airline pilot, or any other type of pilot don't come anywhere close to 90k… I know because I am a pilot. Yes, there are a select few holdovers from pay scales that are very old, but the majority of pilots that are flying today are scraping by. I'm talking 20-30k being a GOOD paying flying job…
Exactly! I don't want to know what a federally paid clergy man believes in.
I suppose the federal government finally adopted the private sector's recruitment and retainment strategies: paying their employees well deserved "bonuses" and "competitive salary." Why should the federal government get all the private sector's leftovers? It's about time we have competitive, competent, and intelligent employees working for the feds. The best way to lure them from the private sector to the govt is to offer comparable salaries and bonuses. It's all to the greater good (i.e., greater efficiency). Quit your griping.
I suppose the federal government finally adopted the private sector's recruitment and retainment strategies: paying their employees well deserved "bonuses" and "competitive salary." Why should the federal government get all the private sector's leftovers? It's about time we have competitive, competent, and intelligent employees working for the feds. The best way to lure them from the private sector to the govt is to offer comparable salaries and bonuses. It's all to the greater good (i.e., greater efficiency). Quit your griping.
[...] » Now, I Definitely Want A Job In Government – Big Government [...]
I would proudly serve my country by working for the federal government. What's wrong with that?
Only problem our grandchildren are paying for them right now. It is going to blow up in their faces.
[...] tip to Big Government for the pointer to USA Today. Key [...]
All But two make more money hmmm
Wait….we have DENTAL ASSISTANTS on the federal payroll???!!
This doesn't elicit tears, but it does make me want to puke.
Yes, clergy work for Uncle. I've known several. One in particular comes to mind, a Navy Captain. He went routinely on patrols with Marines near the DMZ. He went armed only with his communion chalice, and the other things he needed to perform his duties as a chaplain. Those included the things needed to perform the last rites on young Marines who died in his arms. He also had among his decorations the Navy Cross and the Purple Heart with clusters. In combat, when he wasn't performing the last rites, he was crawling, unarmed, into the line of fire to give first aid to wounded Marines.
These figures are skewed. Nowadays, the average US Government professional or other worker now is generally older than the rest of the workforce, has put in 25-30 years, and has worked up the food chain within their job classification to earn more through longevity. The average private sector worker in the same categories is younger and hasn't put in the time to get to the same age and, presumably, value for their experience and knowledge.
I don't see doctors there. Care to know what the average US Government doctor makes? It's far less than they do in the private sector, and most of them are in uniform, many of whom work in combat zones. Others work in Embassies, travel their assigned regions, and like most diplomats, work knowing they are targeted by terrorists.
Dental assistants? Most are in uniform or work for the VA, and like others, have put in the time to work up the pay scale. Same with so many others in that list. What you don't see in those numbers are the years spent on deployment away from families in dangerous locations or at sea for months at a time. They don't get in their cars at night and drive home to have dinner with their families.
The private sector job salaries listed are probably taken from what is being paid in this major economic downturn. All private sector pay is now depressed since it is a buyer's market. When the good times rolled and when they roll again, and when private sector salaries in so many of those categories once again begin to outstrip Federal workers' salaries, let's see how many people like Veronique de Rugy log in here and demand parity for US Government workers
This is a tired old canard and Big Government ought to be ashamed for repeating this "USA Today" rabble rousing. Andrew Breitbart, who I admire for his guts in taking on the liars in the MSM and so many other bastions of liberalism, has recently demanded retractions for poorly-researched and outright lying articles about people like James and Hannah. I'd like to see if he does the same fact-checking with this major misrepresentation.
See my post below. The Navy Chaplain I knew earned $65.50 a month extra — Combat pay. I'd like to see you walk up to that tough mother and say that to his face. He was a tough old Irishman with scars from gunshot wounds inflicted by the VC, and despite his Roman collar, I'm sure he would deck you in a heartbeat.
You ought to get down on your knees and thank God there are people like him and so many other Feds who routinely live far less comfortable lives out of a sense of duty to this country and its citizens.
Knock it off with slamming Federal clergy – They're almost all in uniform.
See my post on the next page and then decide if they should be ridiculed.
Are these true figures? So you mean to say, it's ideal to work in a government rather than working on private companies? Also, if this is true, taxes paid by every working individual goes to the salary of those people working for the government?
This entire article and screed of rants following it needs some reality bites and fact checking.
Feds get pretty good medical benefits because the federal workforce as a unit gets bids from insurers. The sheer volume of customers in the Federal workforce gives our negotiators a lot more bargaining power and allows the insurers to offer more for the same prices paid in the private sector.
The OLD retirement system was just like the military's: 50% retirement pay for 20 years work. 75% retirement pay for 30 years work. That went by the boards quite a while ago.
The NEW retirement system is now: 1/3 agency retirement pay; 1/3 Social Security; and, 1/3 401-K. That's not much different from most private sector companies' retirement packages.
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