Sunday Open Thread: France Edition
by PubliusToday, in 1778, France declared war on Great Britain, in support of the American Revolution. It is doubtful whether the Revolution would have succeeded without France’s assistance.
(Happy Birthday Libby!)
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81 Comments
Oh, we were all such idealists back then weren't we? Three things I'd like to say about the French-
1. I don't really blame the Canadians (just a diddy that I picked up from South Park, which I really never watched either)
2. Louisiana Purchase wasn't as bad of a deal as I've made it out to be (I watch the series "Swamp People" and realize that these guys are the last Americans who understand freedom, though now that the cameras are down there I'm sure new regulations and govermental bureaucracies will follow.)
3 And thank you for the Statue that continues to be our symbol of Liberty. (we promise to clean her up as soon as we can scrape off the Progressive Politicians who have been piling on her as of late ).
Oh, and I won't even mention "Freedom Frys" if you don't…
Apart from that nasty business while France was under mob rule(You know that whole, you owed the King money, we killed the king and all his heirs, so you therefore owe us the money, business), France has been our most reliable ally when times really get tough.
France was one of the first countries to send troops to Afghanistan. Their special forces have seen a lot of action.
France has a lot of commies and far left nut cases…..but so do we….in our case we even have a commie in the White House. But there are millions of conservatives in France who hate the moslem invasion, who hate the loss of their freedoms and the destruction of French culture.
Dear Leader played up his role as a "World Leader" before the election and immediately after. He appealed to commies and socialists and anti-western culture nuts everywhere. I hope when we throw both he and his ideas out in 2012, that the new president will be someone of Reagan's stature. A conservative leader who will support and champion freedom and the moral superiority of Western Culture throughout the world.
Instead of sending troops to France to fight as we did in two wars with the soldiers saying: "Lafayette we are here" we can send a message of the moral supremacy of Western Culture and Philosophy that will inspire our conservative brethren in France to also stand up and take back their nation from the forces of collectivism and fight the rising tide of islam.
Right on Ex, hope the vitamin deficiency is beaten and you are back to your caring self. God bless Sedgewick, Alberta. Nice place for oil and everclear. Screw islam.
I ask you one serious question though sir, what is Libya about?
You are correct Publius….
Though we have not been on the best terms with France for a long time………..
The simple fact is we owe our very existence to France, two hundred thirty five or so years ago their motives may not have been totally altruistic, but nevertheless, without the loans and support secured through the efforts of Franklin, Jefferson, and Adams we would still be a member of the United Kingdom…
Many years ago while spending time in Paris, I made the effort to visit Lafayette's grave. It's located in a secluded private cemetery (Picpus) in the back yard of a convent, and you need an appointment to visit it. Most French people I know didn't even know it was there. Just a few feet away from Lafayette, are two mass graves of people beheaded by the guillotine at what is now known as Place de la Nation. There was an American flag over his grave when I visited as well.
If you're a history buff like me, try to see it if you're ever in Paris.
PS – just did a google search and apparently the cemetery is open to visitors on a regular basis now.
Though we have not been on the best terms with France for a long time………..
de Gaulle
So France declared war on its eternal enemy just to help the american revolution, err…? More stupid people will think France wanted to use the war in which England was embroiled to achieve it's own agenda… but they are stupid of course.
It isn't really doubtful that it would have succeeded and it really wasn't France but a French citizen (an aristocrat, no less), the Marquis de LaFayette to whom the praise should go. He was, at the time, serving as a general under Washington in the Continental Army. It was during his return from France to seek support for the American effort that Cornwallis was blocked from a retreat by the naval forces that joined him and the accompanying French military led by Rochambeau. It was the ships that forced Cornwallis' surrender as he was outgunned on the peninsula by the Continental Army.
Hey cretin, get a dictionary….and read my post….
I really love South Park, they really put it to liberals which is the real reason Comedy Central dropped them.
He also bought home with him a trunk full of American soil which he is buried under, learned that in school in the fifties.
… the supportive presence of the French fleet in Colonial waters was key…
American and Revolution are both capitalized – show some respect – ya puddle of dog puke.
It's the classic "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" axiom. This is the reason why American lefties side with the likes of islamofascists, for example.
Nah… they were capitalized. Now american is with *very* small "a". On the other hand… well China is really capitalized now.
If you admire China so much, why don't you try moving there. You wouldn't survive for a week. Don't forget to apply for a visa. And remember mommy has to write a letter saying she will support you and that you will not be a burden on the commies. Of course the Chinese will quickly recognize you have no marketable skills.
"…….It is doubtful whether the Revolution would have succeeded without France’s assistance………"
and as a result,……..
It is doubtful whether D-Day would have succeeded without America's assistance.
Excellent post regarding LaFayette, zebo. He was as supportive of our revolution as anyone- financially or otherwise.
"Early in the year 1780 Lafayette's hard work with the French government resulted in the success of sending French troops to aid Washington and additional needed supplies. So insistent was Lafayette for aid to the Americans that one day Count de Maurepas said in the royal council: "It is fortunate for the King, that Lafayette does not take it into his head to strip Versailles of its furniture, to send to his dear Americans; as his Majesty would be unable to refuse it." In addition to governmental supplies Lafayette purchased out of his private account a large amount of supplies for the troops he would command on his return to America." http://www.ushistory.org/valleyforge/served/lafay...
Damned if I know. Gaddafi is a nut case and power crazy. He had dreams of being the next Nasser at one point in the 1970's. He tucked his head in his shell after Reagan sent a few F-111's to visit. One of my classmates from the Agency is the guy who "talked" him out of developing a bomb and turning over his yellow cake (unprocessed uranium).
I have been out of the business for a long time but it appeared that Gaddafi jsut wanted to be a local dictator. He was not helping Al Qaeda or the Moslem Brotherhood. I doubt of he allowed them santuary because they would undermine him and take over the country.
I think that he was simply an aging arab despot who liked European escorts and wanted to be left alone. Dear Leader seems to have gone after him for no reason…other than adding another country to the list controlled by the moslum brotherhood. I really think this is an effort by Dear Leader to bring the mideast under the control of the moslum bortherhood.
de Gaulle was the problem. That and they really wanted us to help them in Viet Nam. They were fighting reds just like we were in Korea. They never could understand why Eisenhower did not give support…and then sent troops to Viet Nam after the French left.
Really…my daughter is there on an internship in Beijing. She went over thinking it would be great. She is half Asian and speaks Chinese. Much of the city is dirty, in some areas adults and children urinate on the sidewalks. Mush of the food can not be trusted to be wholesome.
It is a third world country with millions of slave laborers that has nuclear armed missiles. Beijing and other cities are full of countryside peasants who have moved to cities looking for work….they are pushy on the streets and even city dwelling Chinese do not trust them so they are locked in enclaves at night and guarded by police. Oh yeah…and forget about free speech, religion and the right of assembly.
China is capitalist in name only. It is still a commie dictatorship.
Unfortunately I am too old to move to another country (and no – I do not live in US neither I am an US citizen).
And this doesn't change the truth US is becoming a riff-raff kingdom. You will be very surprised what will happen with it until 2016. And don't try to feed me with the BS the american people will vote Obama out of the office in 2012; 50% of the american citizens don't pay taxes – who they will vote in 2012 for, how do you think? For someone who promises to give them jobs or for someone who promises to give them more freebies? Add to this 95% of the blacks, 2/3 of the latino voters, 2/3 of the jews, between 12 and 20 mil illegals, the public unions, the lamestream media and the Bolywood. Who can beat this combo?
Not to mention US became the pariah in the world. Everyone is taking your money and then is laughing at your back.
And a current battle, Ground Zero mosque to move, source confirms … http://placeitonluckydan.com/2011/07/breaking-new...
Did you notice the election results in Nov. 2010? The "shellacking" will continue on a more intense level in 2012. Care to place a nice bet? You worry about your elections and we will take care of ours. Never underestimate "real" Americans.
Just another case of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend."
Yeah, that logic worked well for Carter.
And by the way, if you're so concerned about capitalization, "Latino" and "Jews" are also to be capitalized.
LaFayette, like deToqueville, saw something special in the United States of America. I wonder what they would think today!
That's true. But just few years ago they were poor as the poorest african country. In couple of years they will become the world #1 economy – just two decades to go from rags to the riches. They may be a commie dictatorship but their commie dictators are smart enough not to mess the politics with the economics. Just few years ago they were making only cheap low tech gadgets; now all the big companies are opening high tech plants there. What to bet how many years will take for Boeing (for example) to move its plants there?
Personally, I do not believe America would have prevailed, had it not been for France becoming our ally. Had we, the Revolution would have been further protracted, and bloody.
We have helped France a time or two since.
9,386 Americans lying here in Normandy would attest to that http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://ptl201...
You mean those americans which elected Murkowski in Alaska? All those americans 45% from which think Obama is doing great job? No incumbent president can lose the elections if it starts with 45%.
Alaska's population is way less than 1% of the population here, As of yesterday, the difference between those who strongly approve of the Marxist versus those who strongly disapprove is -18%. Say what you wish, but Rasmussen is consistent and reliable as a pollster. http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/po...
The problem is those who "strongly disapprove" have just one vote each – absolutely the same as those 45% who generally "just" approve.
Edit: And who exactly will beat Obama? Romney? He will be just another Bush. Or the clown Newt?
The Carter reelection result was based on performance. Both Obama election and reelection are based on race and on politics. Which means the blacks may be much worse under Obama then under Bush but they still vote Obama etc. It is the same with leftists votes – look what is going on in California. It is broken state but nevertheless it votes overwhelmingly for the leftists. It is not the tanks which were preserving Soviet Union for almost a century – it existed because of the brainwashing (and as a matter of fact the things are the same even now – 95% of the russian populations thinks "We sux because everyone envy us and is trying to destroy us." They will never believe actually no1 cares for them besides their closest neighbors which are not sure when they go to sleep will they see the russian rusty tanks on the streets when they get up in the morning.)
Yes. Our debt to France has been paid. In full and with interest.
<—————–Doesn't care much how they do things in Europe.
The Carter reelection result was based on performance. Both Obama election and reelection are based on race and on politics.
Because you say so. I suppose the vast majority of minorities didn't vote for Carter.
And I see your concern for proper capitalization, not to mention grammar, has broken down, so I shall not press the matter further.
We can always count on France to be there when they need us…
Paid in full.
In blood.
Speaking of stupid, you are pretty high on the list.
Get a receipt…
Repeat: I ignore the reality. I ignore the reality. I ignore the reality… See? The reality disappeared. It is needed only to wish for it.
And then take care to wake up.
While I thank France for what they did to help us win our freedom they have done a lot things wrong since!
Walter Hanson
Minneapolis, MN
Rrrright! When you have to add crescents to all the 57 stars on US flag I hope me being stupid will comfort you.
"Much of the city is dirty, in some areas adults and children urinate on the sidewalks."
When was the last time you were in New Orleans, Chicago, Baltimore, etc…………
We blew our chance to help them in Viet Nam. We were fighting Reds in Korea and refused their request for help in Viet Nam. They were mainly asking for logistics and air support, not ground troops. Their soldiers were on the ground, knew the enemy and doing the job.
So we ignored the request of an ally….and then ended up sending in almost 500,000 Americans a few years later and lost over 50,000. Yep, that was a smart decision to turn our backs on the French.
Now, now… this is racism.
Tc, tc, tc…
France helped us in a time of need, we helped France in a time of need. Let's call it even and get the liberals out of both countries.
Welcome to the Democratic Socialists of America! http://www.dsausa.org/pdf/DSA_Organizing_Manual.p....
/ Spit !!!
Go to every Libtard blog site
Write this
: "Don't belive our leaders,
belive your own eyes, nobody is spending
much money, just look at the empty stores and shops,
because a new 2 trillion in taxes on the rich will end up as it always happens
the poor people and the middle-class will end up paying for it all in the long run"
http://dancingczars.wordpress.com/2011/04/29/can-...
You do not know what you are talking about. China has a few people at the top who live very well…and most of those are members of the Communist Party or have close family who are members. There is little work in the rural areas and peasant who move to cities are now being required to stay in designated gated areas at night and are locked in and guarded until daybreak.
My wife is from Japan. She did her high school and university in Taiwan and speaks perfect mandarin. She was one of the first foreign students accepted in a major university in Shanghai in 1983…most people were still wearing Mao jackets. She spent a year in that university. She traveled to Beijin many times in the early 1980's. When she came back from escorting our daughter over two weeks ago she was shocked at what she saw. Much of the city had not changed in the last 30 years. Some districts had been demolished and replaced with condos and shopping centers like you would find in Newport Beach/Irvine, CA. But what really caught her eye was the mass of countryside peasants…out of work and just roaming….looking for jobs.
You have no idea what you are saying. China is NOT capitalistic. The economy is for the most part centralized and under government direction. They have limited knowledge or concern about customer satisfaction and ways to promote repeat business….things that are at the core of a vibrant free economy. They have slave labor prison work camps. They crack down on any dissidents and arrest them in the middle of the night.
If you like it so much move over there. My daughter….like most young people had an idealistic thought of what life in China would be like. A friend of hers in high school was an exchange student from Shanghai. She is now going to Harvard. She showed my daughter pictures and videos of he parents house in Shanghai and spoke of the three servants. Her father owns a large business. In one discussion with her about life in China I happened to say…is your father a member of the communist party? Her answer was "Of course." Then I asked if she was a member and the answer was the same. They are part of the communist elite. My daughter is careful what she says on the phone since all calls are monitored by computers. But she did tell me after her fist week: "Papa, you were right….I now see what you mean."
Move there and see the glories of the dictatorship of the proletariat and the new communist elite. And learn something about economics and international politics. China is a powder keg because rural areas are suffering. the central government is buying massive amounts of oil on the world market and then selling it internally for less than they paid for it. they are artificially propping up the economy holding down riots….yes riots….read about police stations being overrun in the rural provinces. All of this is being done by selling goods abroad that were built by prisoners or peasants who work for next to nothing.
What racism? Major cities in the US have been declining for years. The US Supreme Court came out with an opinion in 1978, while I was still in law school, that opened the doors of nut houses across the country. People who can not string a sentence together, much less work, were set free…free to collect welfare checks, live in cardboard shacks and defecate in doorways.
Yes, it would appear you employ that mantra very well.
Aren't you a russian by chance? Because you sound exactly like the soviet propaganda some 30 year ago. Only it was "US" instead of "China". The soviet propaganda explained how in US just a few ultra rich people could afford to buy food and other goods from the shops; all the others live under the bridges and eat what they can find in the garbage cans.
As for China if you cared to read a little bit you could learn China has US$7600 per capita in 2010 and the average monthly salary in the big cities is US$ 500 per month. It may not seem much but US$ 500 in China are worth more then US 2000 in US. Of course in the rurla areas the incoem is lower and they do have very poor people there. According to CIA fact book 56 .000.000 rural dwellers are very poor with annual income under US$ 125 per year. A whooping 56.000.000 from 1.300.000.000. And all this is just for 20 years.
Yeah… and 90% are black and latino, right?
Seem like every one of you damn trolls always seem to throw "Jew' in most of your comments, don't you morons know that much hate only leads to ulsers? Damn stupid if you ask me.
Who will beat Obama?
Any patriot. Anyone willing to show a love for America and the desire to see it succeed would be better than this dictator.
Aren't you stupid by any chance?
You sound just like today's propaganda that wants to see America destroyed.
Yeah…. and 90% are liberal democrats, right?
Why is it always about skin color to you leftists?
Was that supposed to make any sense?
Or did you just think it was time to post a comment?
And muslims came her by choice. They can also make the choice to leave and go back to a sharia environment. Other countries are dealing with their sharia compliant immigrants, we should too. http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/AS-Australia-Unv...
What I find interesting is that we are still on our first republic and they are in their 5th republic.
Obviously the French who saw something special about our system were right.
He marched through our City Biddeford, Maine, there is a plaque on a Church on Jefferson St. where he worshipped on Sunday and he also stayed in Broads Tavern on Elm St. now Deering Lumber, there is a plaque there also, if I remember right he was on his way to Quebec, Canada.
What exactly are your problems with the fact jews are voting overwhelmingly for Obama?
Actually what I wrote was:
"So France declared war on its eternal enemy just to help the american revolution, err…? More stupid people will think France wanted to use the war in which England was embroiled to achieve it's own agenda… but they are stupid of course."
Roger… do you know what alphabet is? Letters? Such small black thingies? They can be used to write things; some people even can read things with them… not in your case, of course.
I realize that sloppy editing makes it easy for you to twist your words around later.
But do you want another try to post a sentence that makes a clear point?
Do you meant that it's a problem that Jews are for Obama?
Do you mean that it's a good thing that Jews are for Obama and we don't like that?
And do you realize that support has been slipping? http://thejewishchronicle.net/view/full_story/991...
Yes I realize what you wrote. I think it's really bad writing, that you're wrong and you tried to straddle the fence by the way you worded it.
France had many reasons for supporting us. To try to isolate one of them and insist it was the only one is faulty logic.
You can't argue the issues. I understand that. Everyone voting you down does probably.
But I did expose your racist tactics and mocked them.
I guess there is a reason you have that -78 score.
Hey commie, you made comments in several posts that I will address in one. First, I am not Russian. Part California Indian…we were here before the rest of you. The rest comes from European immigrants who arrived in the US between 1836 and 1852. My family had been here for a long time.
As the name implies I am a former foreign intelligence case officer….if you do not know what that means…look it up. Active duty Air Force…nuke missiles…reserve…criminal investigations. Civilian…JD/MBA.
I know what I am talking about. I know how to do research. My wife is close to as far left as I am right, so when she tells me much of Beijin was dirty and had not changed, I believe her….plus my youngest daughter who is a food and life style snob hated the place.
As for race…you race baiting commies do not have anything else to say. You always fall back on race to deflect discussion and make up facts. You scum disgust me. I debated and crushed your types in undergrad and all the way to Stanford Law School. You pointed headed drones do not have a clue.
Learn history, learn facts and learn how to debate.
I noticed you did not comment one time on my reference to the Chinese economy being propped up with slave criminal labor. You do not want to touch that one do you comrade? What…your canned racism racism screech does not apply to that one does it?
Crawl back into your hole drone. You progressive scum make me sick.
I love it…you quote from the CIA fact book…..you progressive scum….I used to work for the CIA…they trained me and I think I know a heck of a lot more about the asian gulag known as China than you.
Baltimore?
What?
Dirty yes, Urinate on the streets…Again (i guess)….Yes
I live in Baltimore…some of the time… and after a bunch of beers and sure…I'll urinate on the street…SO WHAT!
It all goes down with the wash
Care to join me Cowboy…I tend to think youed like it all the same chap
They'd be shaking their heads at us. One could only surmise what they would have thought about what France has become.
Cowboy, I think that America would have succeeded because at the time of Cornwallis' surrender at Yorktown, the tide had already turned in our favor. You might suggest that without France's alliance, that American wouldn't have won, but that had more to do with LaFayette than with King Loius XVI.
We shouldn't forget Thaddeus (Taduesz) Kosciuszko for his efforts for American Independence either. Such a hero he was to America and Poland. Although he wasn't a king, he was so highly thought of that when he died (in Switzerland) the Poles had him buried with them in Wawel Castle in Krakow.
Australia's highest peak is even named after him.
Welcome to the website of the Warrior Open, a tournament featuring U.S. servicemen and women who were severely wounded in the global war on terror. http://www.warrioropen.com/application
You're dreaming if you think minorities will vote in the numbers they did in 2008. It isn't about having a Black president anymore. They have one already.
Truthfully, where I come from, we have a saying/
"If a man can't piss in his own front year, he's living too close to town".
That was a beautiful smackdown. Bravo.
Let's not forget that the colonies were helped by "royalist" France. In 1794 the French Revolution took place. From 1798 to 1800 we fought a naval war with "revolutionary" France. brought about by French anger over U.S. neutrality in the resulting continental America's refusal to pay debts that had been owed to the (former) French crown. We've had an interesting relationship with the French ever since. Well we did give them Jerry Lewis.
I think I hurt his feelings………hmmm…..do commies have feelings?
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