Tuesday Open Thread: von Steuben Edition
by PubliusToday, in 1778, Friedrich Wilhelm von Steuben arrived at Valley Forge, Pennsylvania to begin formal training of the Continental Army. The Minutemen and state Militias were important in the early days of the Revolution, but we didn’t win Independence until we had a professional, disciplined regular Army. Something to keep in mind this year.
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"Keep away from people who belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great."
~Mark Twain
This country will again be great…!
So what your saying is— The Tea Party needs a Leader !!! I still say no as this year its all about local elections, maybe come 2012 for the Presidential election, still whats the harm in having 5 or 6 in the primary and then supporting the winner of the primary at the end ?? I doubt the Indy's will listen to the MSM like they did with McCain saying he was the only one that could win.. This pres. election will be much differant as all Tea Partiers have the same goal "No More Taxes and small Government"
von Steuben was a great Character in our history. I am still amazed that in the cold (you know prior to all that global warming) with no food, and just the stregnth of General Washington to hold the troops together. von Steuben trained our army in these conditions and also created the Aim, from Ready – Fire.
This guys was something of a fake but he did deliver. This guy's history could make a great movie.
von Steuben was a memorable character in our history
The point is well taken that we need a professional, well disciplined army, with a leader as well.
A further point to bear in mind, that the Hessians gave US quite a bit of hell as well.
von Stuben made rabble into an Army. Thank you still – 230 plus years later…
The War of Independence lasted 8 years, 1775 -1783. I wonder how long this one will last?
The rest of my lifetime I'm afraid.
We should all, never grow complacent again.
We once again need someone with his talents.
It's a miracle Washington kept the army intact until von Steuben could whip them into shape.
"You say to your soldier, 'Do this' and he does it. But I am obliged to say to the American, 'This is why you ought to do this' and then he does it".
Friedrich Wilhelm Augustus Baron von Steuben
I agree, the Hydra is more frightening, besides as long as the net is "free" it can remain a force. As for McCain everytime he gained in the poles he alienated voters who got charged (apoligize for another's words eg. middle names), he really did not want it.
For the open thread.
Everything is relevant.
This is the most important piece of business news released in a generation (although two days old now) and the MSM nor anyone else is talking about it.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ba370018-1f19-11df-9584...
Most people fail to pay attention to this sort of thing, many don't care, and for the rest the implications go right over their heads. The geopolitical impact behind this news is huge. The US is further sinking into irrelevancy on the world stage. Crude is tied to WTI (West Texas Intermediate) which is the benchmark, and further crude is pegged to the US Dollar, which is the benchmark reserve currency for all oil settlements. Watch US further slide to oblivion, as the Chinese Yuan soon replaces the dollar as thw worlds reserve currency.
He brought discipline and pride, discipline in today's culture has such a different connotation and pride has become arrogance. Tehcumsa your people have grown in number, we belong to this land, we do need your sight.
"Drill, Baby, Drill !" – Baron Friedrich von Steuben, translated from the Prussian.
Maybe Publius is telling us that we have to stay focused, and
if something doesn't go the way we thought it should, (Scott Brown),
not to give up hope, regroup, and focus on the bigger picture….
Yeah, I'm a little surprised that todays open thread isn't about crude going to $80…Or that yesterdays open thread should have been about G. Washington's b-day…?
Somebody obviously has their finger on the scale when it comes to crude prices though…!
[...] Cafe – ROFL: Lame White House “Photo of the Day”… Tres. Secretary Tim Geithner Grocery Shopping with Michelle Obama? – Tuesday Open Thread: von Steuben Edition Possibly related posts: (automatically generated)122Envy – A Dangerous Heart [...]
Von Steuben is honored with this statue in Lafayette Park, on Jackson Square, just across Pennsylvania Avenue from the White House:
http://dc.about.com/od/dcparks/ss/LafayettePark_6...
It's worth observing that the fact of von Steuben's work runs counter to a rather unfortunate aspect of our Foundation Legend (all countries have one, of course), and that is the Myth of the Guerilla. Far too many schoolkids get the impression that the Revolution was won by ragged riflemen shooting from behind the rocks and trees at stupid British, who were so dumb as to wear bright red and march in straight lines.
The reality was very different. The redcoats were schooled in ordered fire by platoon volleys, the formations necessary to maximise the effectiveness of that fire- and then to settle the matter with the bayonet. The result of pitting those ragged riflemen against cold steel can be seen, for example, at Brooklyn Heights: not pretty.
The problem with the Myth of the Guerilla is that it has left the American public disposed to overestimate the effectiveness of, and often even sympathise with, crews like the Viet Cong, the Iraqi insurgents, the Taliban. There is no reflection on the fact that irregulars are only effective as an auxiliary to a regular military force, whether the Maquis to the AEF, Lawrence's Arabs to Allenby, or the Viet Cong to the NVA..
So let us praise von Steuben! And let's put a little more emphasis on the Prussian-drilled Continental line, who went toe-to-toe with the Redcoats at Monmouth and held, who took the bayonet to the Guards Battalion at Guilford and broke them, who took Redoubts 9 and 10 at Yorktown with cold steel, muskets unloaded.
…and they're brain-dead the rest of the time….!
I believe the Myth of the Guerilla was permanently etched in Revolutionary War history by the actions of April 19, 1775, when the British regulars, marching back from the Battle of Concord to Boston were constantly harassed and took many casualties from the farmers and shopkeepers firing from behind trees and stone walls.
It was a great "victory" to end the day that started at Lexington with "the shot heard 'round the world".
Though a bit of a phony, “von Steuben” …was the right man at the right time to firm up an army in need of discipline, order, and military cadence…divine providence? Perhaps!
Yeah, I wonder who'll be riding around in all those UN military police vehicles?
I would read it as the Tea Party needs people to train and encourage others to work together better.
Wisconsin's governor during the civil war was also a Prussian trained officer. Edward Salmon organized the Wisconsin Regiments along Prussian lines. The main difference with other states is Wisconsin sent reinforcements to it's experienced Regiments where other states raised new raw Regiments even late into the war. In Sherman Memoirs he states Wisconsin Regiments were worth 4 other Regiments by the end of the war. 3 of 4 Regiments in the Iron brigade were from Wisconsin.
My Great Great Grandfather Anton Served in Wisconsin's 9th Infantry Regiment.
Despite complaining about the incessant parade of recommendation-seekers vexing him to no end, B. Franklin, then envoy of the fledgling U.S. to the Court of Louis XVI., made exceptions. On Sept 4, 1777 he made one that changed history and probably saved victory for his cause. Even inflating the experience of the recommandee, he wrote this letter addressed to Gen. Washington, the draft of which has survived::
Passy, near Paris, Sept. 4. 1777.
Sir
The Gentleman who will have the Honour of waiting upon you with this Letter is the Baron de Steuben, lately a Lieutenant General in the King of Prussia’s Service, whom he attended in all his Campaigns, being his Aide Camp, Quarter-master General, &c. He goes to America with a true Zeal for our Cause, and a View of engaging in it and rendring it all the Service in his Power. He is recommended to us by two of the best Judges of military Merit in this Country, M. de Vergennes and M. de St. Germain who have long been personally acquainted with him, and interest themselves in promoting his Voyage, from a full Persuasion that the Knowledge and Experience he has acquir’d by 20 Years Study and Practice in the Prussian School may be of great Use in our Armies. I therefore cannot but wish that our Service may be made agreable to him. I have the Honour to be
His Excelly Gen. Washington
great quote. thanks.
All the dirty laundry on the secret deals Obama made with the Pharmaceutical industry were on PBS Fresh Air today. The secret meetings by Billy Tauzin and Max Baucus and the 150 million spent by Pharma on advertising for Healthcare were noted. As was the Big money Pharma stands to make with forced health care and no drug cost cutting measures.
He also tells why the House Bill did not fly because of drug cost cutting measures in it.
If Rep's do not demand testimony on these secret negotiations from Billy Tauzin than they are idiots.
Here is the link.
http://www.correntewire.com/paul_blumenthal_sunli...
Love American History but somehow missed this General.
I will be reading up on him as soon as possible.
Thanks for the enlightenment!
Amazingly, the origins and purpose of all this chaos are predicted and accounted for in the best selling, prophetic, political Conspiracy Thriller book, BLACK ROAD 2012, which I bought on amazon, and was a real goose-bumpy, totally absorbing ride: http://tinyurl.com/amazon-BLACK-ROAD-2012
Right on enoughallready. Just as the internet keeps chugging along with no single point of failure , same goes the people. Once you pick a leader, the leader will be picked apart. It's too soon. Let's keep "crowdsourcing" this revolution. It will all come together.
Whatever the "Tea Party" movement is – one of it's strengths is in its diffuse nature – and targets that are spread out are tough to hit(just ask Iran) – "We The People" are upset about so many things in our federal establishment that we are voicing them one or many at a time. In time this force will incur change and that will be in November 2010. Our movement for truth, justice and the American way has a leader – just look in your mirror. It is you my friends who are leading these politicians I don't think I or Sam Adams would have it any other way. It was a a greek philosopher who said, something like, "Drop by drop comes truth followed by wisdom" – he was saying as am I – it takes painful time to persuade our fellow Americans why we are the philosophy (minus the cranks) that will lead to a better life for all.
I am starting to totally miss the point about the Tea Party needing a leader……..
At first, it seemed like a logical next step in the evolution of this American awakening we call the Tea Party movement.
Now I am not so sure that a "LEADER" is required in order to accomplish what it is we want from government.
Does this yearning for responsive government go away if a LEADER does not emerge?
If the Tea Party movement has a STRONG LEADER, then the people will begin to follow the leader rather than follow their own deep beliefs. The most effective thing about the Tea Party movement is INDIVIDUAL THINKERS! Let's keep it that way!
Excellent! LOL!
Good point.
I'm still surprised about Brown.
We need leadership locally, state-wide, and nationally, chosen from the ground up. We have became multi-culture. We now have no common culture to hold us together. People should come to America to become American. We should all work to "promote the general welfare" again, to be "equal under the law". Good organization is needed if we are to win. We need to get every community together, pool our ideas, enforce the law from the local sheriff up. The Founders gave their skills, their time, their fortunes, and many gave their lives to establish this nation. When we get that dedicated, we'll win. "It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ" – PATRICK HENRY
"I conceive we cannot better express ourselves than by humbly supplicating the Supreme Ruler of the universe that the confusions that are and have been among the nations may be overruled by the promoting and speedily bringing in the holy and happy period when the kingdoms of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ may be everywhere established, and the people willingly bow to the sceptre of Him who is Prince of Peace.
The quote above is by Samuel Adams in 1774.
"You continue cursing these men, I can curse them no more."
My favorite Steuben quote. I use it in daily conversation.
You just made my entire day !!
The power of freedom and Washington's character is what kept many of his soldiers following his lead.
An interesting article by Rush Limbaugh's father tells "the rest of the story" about our founding fathers. It is a good read!
Wonder if this, http://business.globaltimes.cn/china-economy/2010... , might have anything to do with it?
Tune in tomorrow…! ; )
The issue with the school kids and why the "Myth of the Guerilla" work so well in summing up the Revolutionary War is somewhat easily explained because it fits nicely within the 6 – 12 paragraphs given to cover the founding of the United States in today's history books used by the various school systems. One could argue that it also aids in marginalizing our founding fathers by insinuating that the best they could muster was a "rag-tag group" of irregulars completely ignoring how many who fought in the Revolutionary War were current or former military personnel during the 18th century.
As to the sympathizing with insurgents and guerillas, I think to some degree it has always been one of our mantra as a nation.. to rise up above regardless of the opposition. This unfortunately allows us as a nation to be more susceptible to causes we initially view as righteous for the people we're supporting. We tend to be "sold" on backing such groups as those you mention and more so in the past when information about these movements and their leaders were harder to obtain than today; however, thanks to the recent advancements in technology as well as the current atmosphere in political and personal beliefs it will potentially be much more difficult to back the wrong group.
Has anyone seen the Barney Pelosi?………………….or is it Nancy Frank?
Hilarious.
http://www.foxnews.com/slideshow/opinion/2010/02/...
No truer words could be said about what the Tea Party Movement is about and why is should remain as nothing more than a focal point for educating/informing the public. The very moment that the Tea Party attempts to become its own political group will be when it gets hijacked by either current standing party or by any extreme political party (i.e. progressives).
The Progressives and their ideas are the reason we find ourselves with the big mess today, along with their want to control everything and anything we do. There ideas sound good and honorable, but lets look at its history. They have given us the great depression, along with big government regulators which have us in the mess we are in now. Capitalism has not failed, only the idea that government knows best. Until we up root these bad ideas from our system, will we prosper once again.
History has allot of the answers we seek today, and tomorrow. So, it is real simple, lets get back to the basics, and root out these progressive ideas and polices which always fail. Allow people to be free to make their own decisions and let freedom ring once again. Then and only then will we thrive once again as a nation.
The Tea Party is the result of big government gone wild, and failing to recognize "We the People" are the boss, not the other way around.
God Bless America
[...] BigGovernment – Tuesday Open Thread: von Steuben Edition Possibly related posts: (automatically generated)INTERVIEW WITH DR. AHMET KURUCertainty [...]
The goal of all is the same: To destroy the American economy! Marxist now control the House, Senate, and Judicial and January 2011 more and more seems like too little too late! Our government is doing a better job in destroying America than the Twin-Towers Bombers did! Again, looking more and more like January 2011 is too late!
I just want to add, that the one nice thing about trolls, is they sleep till noon everyday…!
However, it certainly didn't end the occupation of Boston, nor did Breed's Hill. That only happened after Washington and Knox mounted heavy artillery on the heights.
And what an amazing feat for Knox to get that artillery to Boston from Fort Ticonderoga in the dead of winter….!
It serves the greater myth as well–how many times have you heard people belittle the way the British fought? 'Lining up 50 yards from the enemy and shooting at each other! That's crazy!' Americans have a bone-deep belief in the Mohawk and Lakota ways of fighting. Our military has adopted the Apache way almost entirely, but instead of replacing the European heavy guns theory it is just an addition. Our military combines light infantry with heavy armor and gargantuan firepower. Hit and run is fine for raids, lucky massacres and constructive atrocities around the frontiers, but it never defeats armies. The Zulu didn't win at Isandlwana by using hit-and-run, but by absorbing horrific casualties and running the guns out of bullets, like a Chinese human wave attack in Korea. Even before the Baron arrived, however, the regiments from Delaware and Maryland were pretty top notch, as they proved over and over again. The Continentals and the militias were the ones who needed the training.
The British had the best infantry in the world at the time, and they proved it all around the world. Some claim it was because they were allowed to actually fire their weapons in volley for practice, which the French and Prussians and Russians didn't do at the time, or so the tales tell. The problem for the Continentals wasn't being untried, however; they knew what a volley sounded like already and only too well! They just needed to know the rules of a stand-up fight.
Some will argue that Cowpens and King's Mountain prove that the frontier riflemen were more than a match for British regulars, but then again there were a few battalions from Delaware and Maryland at both battles too.
Fortunately it's a myth our military doesn't buy into, and the Baron has plenty of spiritual descendants in drill sergeants, thank heaven!
Open Thread:
A friend is saving all old print copies of World Book encyclopedias, etc., since history is being rewritten.
"Some will argue that Cowpens and King's Mountain prove that the frontier riflemen were more than a match for British regulars"
I'm not sure how they could make that case. At Cowpens Morgan used the militia as bait to draw Tarleton onto his Continentals and state regulars (plus Triplett's Virginia "militia", effectively a regular battalion). King's Mountain indeed was won by frontier riflemen: but Ferguson's column was Tory militia, not Redcoats.
We neither need nor want a leader, or group of leaders. Think Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, name
some others?? If they are not jockeying for position, they're fighting amongst themselves for media
attention or donations. The media researches them, exposes their foibles, discounts their effective-
ness, basically neuters them. Each of us should be a leader, we won't all be equally effective, but
that won't matter so much once we get them on the run. With instant communications we can easily
call for back-up when we are unable to cope. The problem is will we be ready to assist our brothers
when they ask? We all must make a commitment to do that.
ReaderRedux,…………I cannot even express how angry I am with myself for having sold two sets I
had been storing for 25 years, from my mothers estate. I knew I shouldn't for various reasons but
at the time the 'revision of history' angle never entered my mind. I had 1955 World Book & 1960
Encyclopedia Brittanica. I get ill just thinking about it, I have plenty of room, just got tired of moving
the heavy boxes around to clean.
GRIDLOCK IS THE ANSWER
chopper,……..the obamaroid has told piglosi to stay the hell off tv, she's been sent to the woodshed,
for not being able to get the dims organized sufficiently to push healthcare through. He would like
Harry to be underground also, but Harry is being challenged in Nv, thus can't take a low profile.
He was a big advocate of officers spending time with their soldiers, and not be seperated from the grunts. He would share his meals with the regular foot soldier, and often spend the whole time with them. He also knew that this being an all volunteer army, these soldiers could drop their guns, quit fighting, and go home any time they'd like. When given an order, they often asked……….."Why?"……………hence the quote.
Guilty of the same shortsightedness – got rid of a couple of sets. Who knew?
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