Tea Party Dilemma: Honey, I Shrunk the Party
by Patrick Tuohey
A national coalition of Tea Party activists called Thursday for rallies in several states to announce their dissatisfaction with the Grand Old Party. In an October 22 press release they state:
We are extremely disappointed that the Republican Party (and leaders like Newt Gingrich) has missed the message of the Tea Parties and continues to take conservative voters for granted. We applaud all courageous statesmen (Fred Thompson, Michelle Bachmann, and Dick Armey) and call on other GOP officials to put America’s values over traditional, often corrupt and morally bankrupt, power structures.
This is nothing new, and it is certainly nothing good. I am no partisan apologist, mind you, and would not support Ms. Scozzafava. My first significant political activity was on behalf of Pat Buchanan in the 1992 Republican primary in New Hampshire against a sitting Republican president. You may remember how that ended: Buchanan lost the primary, and President Bush lost the general election.
That election saw another significant split among conservatives. Ross Perot earned the votes of one-fifth of the electorate. While he did less well in 1996 (8%), he significantly split fiscal conservatives from Republicans. Bill Clinton never achieved 50% of the vote in either election–but took office nonetheless. (This didn’t seem to bother Al Gore at the time.) Perot’s organization eventually collapsed amid its own internecine struggles.
Grover Norquist, in remarks to the 2009 Conservative Heartland Leadership Conference, offered this about working together:
[The Right] should work to nominate and elect the most Reaganite Republican we can in any given district or state. Now, we need to understand that that’s going to be a little bit different in Maine than Texas, and so it’s like grading on a curve. I want the two Republicans out of Maine. They are much better than the D’s we would have had out of Maine. Okay? We’ve been disappointed in their votes from time to time. There are two teams, there are two major Parties in the United States. They are heading in completely different directions.
By picking a fight within the GOP and calling for an inquisition against RINOs, Tea Party activists are sowing the seeds of all our defeat. There are plenty of people within the Republican Party with whom we disagree. But reducing our current 218 members in the US House and Senate to a more pure 200 or 190 is no victory at all.
Chris Wilson of Wilson Research Strategies–and a fellow brigand from that 1992 Buchanan campaign–published a similar concern:
I don’t necessarily disagree with how the Tea Party members are expressing their anger and backing a candidate they believe in; however, their work will split the Republican vote and give NY CD23 to the Democrats.
The reason I believe the Republican and Conservative party candidates will fail is because they draw support from the same vote base. If you split the conservative and moderate Republicans in just about any race in the nation, the base erodes and the candidate will lose.
I understand the urge to clean one’s own house, but as I learned from Morton Blackwell, “don’t make the good the enemy of the perfect.” The issue in New York’s 23rd may very well be resolved due to pressure from national conservatives, but a campaign of eating our own is not something we should relish.
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[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Susan Bickford and susan blackburn, Big Government. Big Government said: Tea Party Dilema: Honey, I Shrunk the Party: A national coalition of Tea Party activists called Thursday for r.. http://bit.ly/2KMf62 [...]
ARTICLE QUOTE, "By picking a fight within the GOP and calling for an inquisition against RINOs, Tea Party activists are sowing the seeds of all our defeat. There are plenty of people within the Republican Party with whom we disagree. But reducing our current 218 members in the US House and Senate to a more pure 200 or 190 is no victory at all."
Then obviously the GOP better get their head out of the sand! What part of the constitution and common sense don't they understand?
The N.Y. 23 is a far cry from presidential politics !
Yes, fringe candidates have ALWAYS done the opposite of what those voting for that person, truly wishes; helped the one candidate whom they least wanted to win. OTOH, the idiot power that be who places the worse than a RINO , Mrs. S., in this position, need a severe wake-up call ! Hopefully, this will rattle a bunch of cages.
Should Hoffman not win, it really won't matter, in the scheme of things, which of the two far lefties win; they are cones of each other, with Mrs. Scozzafava being even worse than the Dem candidate.
That's nice and all, but someone needs to tell them we're sick and tired of people who pretend to be "right" but really are not. I'm sick of the two party system yet as long as the democrats stick together like they do it's difficult to do anything else. People should just stop endorsing RINOs and consistently stay on the GOP's butt about it. Every time they do something ignorant remind me of how crazy it is. Don't give them the chance to endorse a whacked out leftist.
Oh , I almost forgot. If the GOP POLITICIANS do not get their act together I will vote for the available independent or write in my own candidate. It's really that simple now this time.
NOTE TO GOP, Purge your party of corrupt, self interest politicians that put special interest groups ahead of common sense and the back home constituents.
Wrong.
There is barely a single word in this article that I can agree with.
I long ago stopped contributing to the RNC. When they call, I tell them that when Republicans start acting like conservatives, then they'll get my money again. Until then I will donate only to real conservatives. They keep telling me how bad Obama and the Dems are and I respond that the current GOP is no better.
Look, I understand that in order to be a majority party, we will have to elect some candidates that I would have to hold my nose, at best, to vote for.
But, when the direction of the party is the same direction as the Democrats, the party has become useless.
Dede shows that the GOP leadership still doesn't understand that, or understand conservatism.
"Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." — John Quincy Adams
"But reducing our current 218 members in the US House and Senate to a more pure 200 or 190 is no victory at all."
I have to disagree. We are in deep, deep trouble as a nation. You've heard the cliche, and I think it is a true one, that the Republicans are walking us off a cliff, and the Democrats are driving us off one. We need to change how our government THINKS, not simply modify how quickly it is going to kill us. Give us some leaders who really think about what the role of government should be, and keep that consideration always in the mind of their constituents. Give us some leaders who, when an interest group asks them for some help, is willing to say "that isn't my job. Vote me out if you have a problem with that." Give us some leaders who believe in the intelligence of the American people, and who will try to explain the actions of the government too them rather than pacifying them with happy cliches.
Give me people like that, and I'll be happy to give up 3 or 4 "Republicans" for every 1 of them.
Thank for saying what I could not seem to say after reading this drivel of an article.
So instead of getting the idjuts in the national party to QUIT backing RINO's, we're suppose to just KEEP letting them push more RINO's on us that will keep voting and supporting Dimocrats bills? Isn't that what got us into this current problem in the first place with McCain?
I'm going to have you put you right up there with the RINO's leading the national party – you don't get it either. These small house races is where we have to START backing Conservatives and getting them in.
What direction the Republican party goes is still in the elitist hands. What direction Tea Party folks go is their constitutional right. Independents will choose based on creditability. Currently my bet is on Tea Party. Remember NY-23.
So if a GOP politician is corrupt we should support them anyway? Don't think so. Does the name Arlen Specter ring any bells? Don't think we should support turncoats. The GOP left me, not the other way around. Get back to fundamental principles and we'll get along fine. I don't want socialism, either by the slow road (RINO/current GOP leadership way) or by the fast way (Democrat Party). Both political parties have abandoned the best interests of a majority of Americans – they ignore the Constitution, they won't deal with illegal immigration, spend more than they should and create bigger government with more regulations. The GOP has the opportunity (and during it's best times) to pick up the standard for liberty (again). If it won't millions of Americans who refuse to become the tax serfs of the self-appointed elites will find another party. We'll find a way to get to a majority and electoral power with the GOP or without. Or we'll repeat 1776, your choice GOP.
I would hate to know my party's main selling point is "We're not them."
Well, guess what? Republicans are, to some degree, Democrats. President John McCain would be doing 60 percent of what President Barack Obama is doing.
That is unacceptable. I don't have a solution, but I can damned well tell you, THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE.
Every one of us knows, without a degree in political science or economics, that John McCain (great American though he is) would've been a terrible president.
I'm ready to let the idiots rule, if we can't do any better than John McCain. SCREW THIS BUSINESS OF CAPITULATION AND COMPROMISE!!!
I completely, utterly disagree with the premise that all we need are more (R)'s. Scuzzy is NOT an (R). I, too, am only contributing directly to the campaigns who truly reflect Conservative platforms (as I did with Hoffman). No more money to the RNC. Newt and Steele need to remember, there weren't 1,000,000 (R)'s in DC on 9/12, there were 1,000,000 that no longer will support the status quo. And that includes Scuzzy.
i hate to tell you this, but average americans are fed up. it has boiled down to a match like a car chase of "chicken" full steam ahead… people with virtue and values are tired of putting up with crap from liars and cheats. i see the value and practicality in "one step at a time " without slitting your own throats" but the masses are fed up…….. and i cant blame them. i think we may be at a point of just stepping out in faith. like a david and goliath situation. you cannot ask people to compromise their values anymore for the sake of liars and cheats. i see an epic battle for power looming….. not fought with weapons and blood, but right vs- wrong. and really, standing up for what is right has never been the easy, or even the comfortable thing to do, ever.
besides, when will a good time to be to get rid of the bad seeds? there is going to be pain involved no matter when it is done, might as well be now… get it over with, purge the corruption, refine the vision and move forward from there. if your "body" is sick you cant tolerate being "partly" sick the rest of your days, you want to get over it… so lets get over it… and be healthy again.
Wait I'm confused.. The Leaders of the Tea Party movement want to tell the GOP to show the RINOs the door and this is a bad thing? If we told the party to shove it and voted for Constitutionalists regardless of party affiliation then how do we lose again? We get Constitutionalists in office and the current corruption is thrown out. Sure the "GOP" may not be in power but who cares as long as there are solid Constitutionalists in Congress.
I agree that we are moving towards a trend that will likely see Republicans lose because the base will be split. The Republicans need to be aware of that NOW and champion people who are true conservatives before the 2010 congressional elections are underway. If they're so concerned about the New York race, perhaps the Republicans can get Scozzofava to drop out and throw her votes to Hoffman. Scozzofava is as liberal a candidate as the Democrat, so nobody loses in this one. Republicans should view this New York race as a wave of the future and get their act together ASAP. However, I don't expect it.
I just love it when people on the right do their best to doom all of one area like say New England with socialists in Republican clothing. Surely conservatives and non-socialists in NE deserve a voice? Or do Republicans in the rest of the not give a damn about NE anymore?
HA! There hasn't been one comment in favor of the views expressed in this post.
We're really not asking for all that much here, just to be represented. It's been a LONG TIME since that's been the case.
Oh so the R party gives us "Democrat lite" and we're supposed to just go along? Maybe 8 years to totalitarianism instead of 4 and that makes a difference? I don't think so. If the Republicans stand for nothing more than "we're not them" as HPJr said above, they are worse than useless, they are a distraction from the business of taking back our country. They are in fact a functional unit of "them", a smoke-and-mirrors act. Either they follow the lead of the tea parties, or they go belly up, we don't care.
I agree voting, with BigGovernment Republicans is wrong that is how we got into this mess.
This is an all or nothing game. We will live by small government or die by Big Government (Rep/Dem knife or gun your choice) .
Why vote for Scozzofava when you have the real thing to vote for in the Demorcrat.
I will not submit.
The fringe candidate in this race really should drop out, permitting a true choice between liberal Democrat and conservative.
We should all call on Ms. Scuzzyfella to leave the race.
A fair point. I think I tend to agree more than most of the commenters preceding me. There are times on here I want to say that we need to put out the fire before we can worry about reclaiming ownership of the property and talk about how we will rebuild. And if that means settling for a vote you can count on 60% of the time, as opposed to 10%, then settle you must. And for most of us here, that choice is more often than not going to be someone who is running as a Republican.
However, since you point out NY-23, it appears that Hoffman is quite electable, and is what many envision as a good Republican candidate. Since the Party chose to snub the conservative base, what reason is there to show any loyalty to the Party? In essence, the Party put this seat in jeopardy, not the conservatives (or the Conservatives). As the larger group, doesn't the GOP have the obligation to shore up its base? Or are they too worried about rewarding a long-time member who really stands for nothing Republican?
The obligation to work together cuts both ways. And there is far more lecturing to Tea-Partiers going on than there is to the GOP. Some of us are old enough to remember Jim Buckley. The GOP forgets him at their expense.
The GOP should have thought of this before they tried to shove the closet Democrats onto us. This time i wont vote for party.
Oh, and dilemma has two m's! (Fix headline.)
I agree with you, Lauren. I was one of those on the 'just vote for the GOP' side for too long. What's going on in this country will not be fixed by putting more and more fiscally challenged Republicans in office. They only get worse and worse and, eventually, become democrats. They do NOT become more responsible, or more likely to take their positions as public servants as seriously as is necessary.
We can't keep going down this road. The GOP establishment seems hellbent for destruction. And they want our money to help them take us down too. We have to push back. NY-23 is an excellent place to do it.
Sorry about that, but none of us in the rest of the Country can (legally) vote for anyone up there. The New England states keep putting up RINO's – so what else are we to think. (Not that other states haven't put them up either – just saying – but the proportions from those states that keep "crossing the aisle" is where you get the reputation.)
And we do care – check with the Hoffman's people and see how much he's getting from all over the country like Joe Wilson is.
I agree with the author. It would be a travesty for the vote to be split and give the W to the Dem.
Dede should resign her campaign immediately and throw her support behind Hoffman. See how easy that is!
As for me, I will vote against any RINO even if it means that the Democrat wins. 2 reasons:
1.) A liberal is a liberal. I don't care what letter is beside their name. It gives the false pretense of bipartisanship when they vote with the liberal democrats. (i.e. Lindsey Graham pairing up w/ John Kerry)
2.) I sadly recognize that politicians feed on power despite the desires of their constituency. If the quest for power moves them in the conservative direction, then that is acceptable. However, it is wrong to reward them with power when they are not representing the conservatives in the nation.
3.) If voting against RINOs results in the country moving left faster, then so be it. The faster we break the country, the faster we can get to the point of agreeing on the founding principles of this great nation.
We may wind up with the Dems in control for a cycle longer, but this is too important to fall for the tired argument that a RINO is better than a Dem. If the Republicans want support from the conservative base they had better start fielding conservative candidates.
Bullsh!t, let the party come to the people, not the people to the party.
I wonder if people who voted for Barack Obama felt they were hurting their party's strength by voting for him.
Sure, if the voters in the area are moderates and a strict conservative or liberal would not fly, you go with the compromise position then you go out and try to cultivate better candidates. BUT once you go down the road of marginalizing your values what do you have left? If there is a candidate that is honest (cough), give a rip about those they might serve and know themselves well enough to abide by their convictions… convictions you share… you vote for him. If not, then you might as well just close up shop and take a dirt nap.
leaders with no power who can enact 0% of your agenda. perfect.
and when because of your actions, Nancy Pelosi gets one more vote for speaker, one more vote to help charlie rangel stay at ways and means, one more vote for barney frank, one more vote for a public option, one more vote for cap and tax, one more vote for the entire democrat agenda — you will feel fine because your heart is pure. Well good for you and BAD for America.
You don't get it.
I pay taxes so Democrats and Republicans can buy votes. Karl Rove and Bush restored agricultural subsidies, started up drug subsidies and started sending federal money to churches. The two Bush Administrations are excellent reasons for starting a new Conservative party.
The country must energize conservatives, not dispirit us like the Bushes. What are we going to do in 2012? Elect Jeb Bush? Please.
"First dismantle the Good Ole Boys network, then get back to me and see what I think. And if you can't do that, STOP F_CKING CALLING ME."
When a Republican crosses the line to a point it exceeds ideology of a nominal Democrat, conservatives are correct to call them on it. NY 23 is more a special case where the official Republican is more "Progressive" than the Democrat. In a three way split, and the Democrat around 33% in a recent poll conservatives and traditional Republicans can team up with the independent. It could land up 40 Independent, 37 Democrat, and 23 Republican in this case.
Best case Scozzafava drops out of the race, she is simply unelectable.
Let’s see, we can vote for “Ms. Bean-shuffler” and have a socialist in that seat, or not do so and have a socialist in that seat, but one that’s not ours. What’s not to like? And Hoffman actually has a chance of winning. I thought we were supposed to vote for the candidate whose views come closest to our own. The only problem with the Tea-partiers is that they aren’t effectively agitating for better DEMOCRAT candidates, so the center can be pushed Rightwards. BOTH parties need to be utterly destroyed, and we need free, fair and open elections in the US.
It may be a travesty to split the vote, but if it takes two election cycles for the GOP to come back to the people, then so be it.
As was posted earlier by Paul Trammell
"Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." — John Quincy Adams
The reason I changed my voter registration to independent was to send a clear signal to both parties they can't just count my vote anymore. I have persuaded at least ten people to do the same. The GOP can see the numbers as DNC can too. Principles first!
we are fighting a closet Democrat in my state also, so dont think only NE is the only one, an we will fight our own fight.
Hey if you want to be one more vote for Arlen Specter because he had a R, or a Dede with an R, that is what America is about, Free Will and Liberty at least for a few more years.
My sympathies, but many of us have our own socialists to deal with to spend too much time worrying about NE. And while I don't think you should be condemned to them, I recognize that the initial responsibility of ridding NE of them belongs to, well, NE. When someone of national prominence emerges from the area who is not a socialist, then perhaps we won't think of the area that way. (And Romney doesn't count, he isn't FROM NE.)
I'm sorry, Mr. Tuohey, but you don't get it. Once we cut the tumor of liberalism out of our party, the healthy body of the GOP will start to attract new voters.
So what if we lose a bit of weight getting rid of these RINOS? We'll gain it all back, and more, when we're a party that embraces and embodies conservative values.
Many yeas ago in Louisiana two unlikely candidates were up for the Govenor's election, David Duke (R-KKK-WTF?) and Edwin Edwards (D-Unconvicted crook, later to be convicted). Republicans had no choice but to throw our votes to a crook. I will never do this again, I will write in my candidate if ever faced with the same or similar circumstances rather than compromise principle.
The days of cultivating politicians is over.
Voting for a RINO is like giving your dog a treat because he only peed on the rug, instead of pooping on it.
Unfortunately the RINO's are a total discredit to the GOP. Some of them, incluing the GOP National Committee are more left than the blue dog liberals. This has been happening for a long time and we let it. The Trojan horse was let in and totally ignored for years. This is a huge dilemma but if we spilt up the party, then we are doomed and the liberals will win again. If we let the country move "left" faster, we will never recover from the chaos that Obama will inflict.____I think we should elect most GOP except for the obvious turncoats (like Spector, Biden and Scuzzyface)and then systematically get rid of the RINOs in the 2012 election. Dont' forget, the Dems are preparing a coalition bigger than in the last election. They will be out full force: corruption, voter fraud and intimidation because they know "we the people" are extrememly dissatisfied. We will have to put extreme pressure on the GOP to either **** or get off the pot. No more pussy-footing around. Our lives depend on it.
Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan
Political parties are not guaranteed eternal life. The Whigs (remember them?) lost their base to the Republicans when its leadership could not agree on extending slavery to the territories.
Perhaps it is time for principled men and woman to pack up and move elsewhere.
By Marion Valentine Saturday, October 24, 2009
As I predicted—though I was unsure whether it would be the H1N1 virus or the collapse of the dollar—the Communist Puppet would use something to cement his total control over every aspect of our lives.
From the day he took office, Obama and his puppet masters have been building a shadow Government with all power vested in them. The Czars he has appointed, who were not vetted and approved by Congress nor elected, now have the authority to control every aspect of American commerce.
I challenge you to look at the Executive Orders that have been signed over the last 30 years and are still in place. Also carefully read the provisions of the Violent Crime Control Act. They are listed here America In Peril and I include a partial list below.
You will see that with the Executive Orders already in place, combined with the provisions of the Violent Crime Control Act, with the stroke of a pen Obama can suspend the Constitution, the Judiciary, Elections and in effect declare himself president for life.
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/1614...
If that works for you, fine. But recognize that in doing so, you then may have forfeited your ability to help select a general election candidate. As for me, I'd rather get involved in directing the party in the proper direction.
I'm no fan of RINOs, but the time to get rid of them is during the primary elections. Undercutting them in the general election is counterproductive, because it puts more Dems in Congress with whom I agree even less.
No $$$ to GOP. Time, talent and $$$ to conservative candidates, wherever they may be. Forget it GOP until you find us again. We are not hard to find. We are back at that place you were before you made that left turn.
Well, then the GOP RINOs had better straighten up and fly right.
That's exactly right. the GOP has abandoned it's core principles and now is only hungry for power by any means. Not too long ago, the talk was of spending their way to a permanent majority…see how well that turned out.
Rich Vail
http://thevailspot.blogspot.com
Mr. Touhey,
I just read another post you wrote:
"It remains to be seen if the political activity that this summer generated hundreds of Tea Party protests and capacity crowd town hall meetings turns into a lasting political force. Many will participate in one event and go back to the daily grind. A few will remain active, and some may even use their outrage to invest their time and treasure into political campaigns."
So, I'm confused – are you saying the tea party people should now just shut the hell up?
Spot On!
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I keep getting literature from the RNC asking for a donation. No way will they get any money from me until they start backing truly conservative values. This is the time to send a message to the republican party. I agree that the primaries is the place to elect the candidate that best reflects those values. I would gladly give to the RNC if they threw their support behind Marco Rubio here in Florida instead of Charlie Crist. The RNC and Michael Steele tell us that they are for conservative values. Put the money where your mouth is and show me that you are for conservative values.
I got the RNC questionnaire / request for money. It pissed me off!!
Half the questions where basically "how much do you hate the Dems." I refused to give any answer to those questions and asked what the GOP plan was. So far, it seems like their plan is to oppose the Dems. That is no plan.
I sent a reply that said I will unwaveringly vote against RINOs. A Republican voting liberal is no different than a Dem voting liberal to me. However, I am not going send a confusing message by voting for a RINO.
If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it.
Marcus Aurelius
Normally, I would agree with you, but the situation in NY-23 is absolutely egregious! As Mark Steyn notes, Dede Scazzafava is a DIABLO (Democrat in all but label only.) It would be one thing if she was pro-gay marriage, another if she was pro-choice, but this woman has voted for tax increases, unbalanced budgets and supports card-check. She is unbelievable. In this case, Hoffman needs support.
That's playing right into current GOP's plans. Dont be surprised if this is not coming game plan to come from the GOP, Save the party, we promise we'll change.
Why do you think the GOP has been so silent lately? They're letting Obama and party shoot themselves in the foot, then they're letting the tea party people run their course, then THEY think they will come in on white horses at the last minute to mop up the votes. Nah, that ain't gonna happen and ain't just me thinking it these day as you can see by the comments to this article. Best of luck
Time to purge Washington of all the corrupt democrats & republicans.,either that or a new 3rd party is required.
Hah! Tell em Laura!
There comes a time when you have to stand up for what you believe’
I am a Dem and if you think I will vote Dem think again.
I know there are a lot of Dems that will not vote Dem and independents,we are votes that will count we need a true conservative base and the GOP isn’t it’
We really need a third party and a true conservative one made up of Dems Repubs and independents’
You screwballs have got this is my team and the dems have their team.This is not a game this is real time business’ I am tired of the bull and I can tell you if they pass a Public Option in the bill and have death panels none of you will have to worry about Teaparties or elections and the Climate Bill has a Trojan Horse in it that will give our democracy away.
And the Dems are getting ready to pass a Bill where we will be in Territoy instead Of the United States we will be the North American Territory with Canada and Mexico we are looking for a Communisum World America get off your ass and on your feet if we do not defeat the Health Bill and the Global warming act you will not have democracy it only takes 2/3 of the Senate to vote your Democracy away you get no vote
Copperpeony said, "I think we should elect most GOP except for the obvious turncoats "
I agree. Vitter(r) my Senator has been working his butt of lately, ck on that vote. Landrieu (d) is a mushy democrat lapdog that has makes no commitments to issues until she has to.
Hard question must asked of all politicians as well as pressured applied at all times.
What shocked me more than anything when visiting DC was the outrageous number of special interest groups having offices there. Lobbying must be regulated as much as it can be according to the constitution.
They branded us "Generation X". They said we had no cause to fight for. They labeled us as lazy, and lost, all the while feeding us their rhetoric of "Equality". They drowned us in a sea of political correctness, while they continued on living contrary to their own words. They tried to use the Earth herself to enslave us. We grew up knowing that we could never trust them, but we never knew where to turn.
We remember the values of the founding fathers, and we know that our politicians are not up to par with them. Now is the time to show them that we not only know their game, but we are united in our cause to stop them. We must, or what will the following generations have to look up to?
Join MyFreePress, LibertyTreeRevolution, Oath Keepers, and other Generation Xers, and help us send the the world a message that Generation X is not going to let them destroy our Values, our Principles and our Liberty. Send us your pictures, so the politicians in Washington DC can see the faces of the people who are willing to stand up against the Tyranny, and Economic Irresponsibility that will destroy our nation.
If you are in Generation X or your children are, please visit this post to see how to submit your pictures.
http://myfreepress.net/2009/generation-x-we-decid...
Well then, maybe the GOP needs to lose some more elections until they get the message. The house will never be "clean" if we continue to be ok with that which is not.
Who cares whether the GOP gets a majority in either house of the congress; more important is that incumbents don't get reelected. The Tea Party may cause the GOP to lose seats, but it doesn't matter because they don't represent us anyway. We won't correct the problems in the congress in one election, be it NY 23 or Nov 2010. But we can send a strong message by not bringing back any incumbents. And then doing the same thing in 2012, and again in 2014, and again and again until THEY get it right. I am all for making sure that incumbents don't make it through the primaries next year, and we happen to have good conservative candidates then we of course should back them.
If the Democrat wins NY 23 it will have very little impact on what happens in the congress between now and Nov 2010. But if Doug Hoffman comes in second in the election, it will give the GOP a few months to decide whether THEY want to lose more seats in congress by backing more of their RINOs.
We can't run scared from these idiots. If we stick to our principles we will prevail, but we've got to be patient.
As Chef Emerill say, BAM!
I found this link on the Huffington Post; looks like the libs are starting to get concerned. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/10...
Just need to get the GOP to start taking notice. Interesting to note that the article doesn't mention NY 23.
I appreciate your perspective. More importantly, I value your concern about the country moving irrecoverably left.
However, I don't think anything is beyond repair. Just look at how we were founded. My concern is a half-step to the right does not put us on the right path. We have been trying that for a while. Just look at how far Newt has moved from his Contract with America!
I think the GOP needs a radical wake up call and a strong and determined return to roots.
The GOP ignores good conservatives, ask Roseann Pulido of Chicago if the RNC even called her after she won the primary. There is also a race in the 10th district of California right now, the GOP candidate has gotten very very little support from the RNC. Where is his 6-digit ad buy and paid staffers?
The GOP has stepped on conservatives too many times. This is the last straw. The RINO's have split the party, let them pat themselves on their backs.
Just remember the TEA Party movement is not a partisan movement. Its not a Republican movement
that truly is the message
NOTE TO GOP, Purge your party of corrupt, self interest politicians that put special interest groups ahead of common sense and the back home constituents.
The intention may not lead to the results we want but it is time ALL politicians take notice. WE THE PEOPLE are fed up with the corruption on either side.
If the republican want to take a stand and stay "enough is enough" they will get the party back together, but I am not seeing the GOP doing that.
Thanks to our wonderful RINOs, the czars would be in place even if they had required Senate confirmation.
Compare the RINO GOP support for Scozzafava with the support they have given to the GOP candidate in the 10th district of California. One is leftist and one is conservative. Guess who gets the funds, attention and staffers?
That is why the TEA Party movement is not a Republican movement. RINO's do not help the conservative candidates within their own party, it is high time we stop funding and voting for the leftists in the party,
When you ask people to vote party over principle we get leftist idiots like Snowe, Collins, Spectre and Jeffords.
Say no.
I agree, but it is even more important to get rid of incumbents during the primaries, not just RINOs. The message must be sent, even if it takes out a few good people. As they say in the army, you've got to expect a few losses in a big operation
You wrote, “By picking a fight within the GOP and calling for an inquisition against RINOs, Tea Party activists are sowing the seeds of all our defeat. There are plenty of people within the Republican Party with whom we disagree. But reducing our current 218 members in the US House and Senate to a more pure 200 or 190 is no victory at all.”
I completely disagree with that statement! A so-called conservative party has no place for liberal congressional leaders or Republican Party support. If I were a liberal, I would want to infiltrate the GOP with liberals; in this case RINOs. Either the GOP needs to support its platform before its politician, or shove the platform up your ass!
True conservatives will not compromise certain conservative values. For all I care, you can call yourself the Christian party, but if your actions don’t reflect your platform/objective, don’t expect Christians to support you. Same with conservatives!
I would rather face the dissolution and demise of the U.S. Constitution today, than make my children and grandchildren have to fight the socialist/Marxist bastards 10 or 20 years from now. They need to see their parents stand up for their rights as guaranteed by our Constitution instead of worshipping another Messiah!
And let's not forget that there are Constitutionalists among independents and even a few democrats. (they just don't dare say so at the moment), speaking up in Washington is dangerous nowdays.
The Constitution way is the way to go, we need to polish this document and make it shine again, protect it and preserve it for generations to come. We are the last bastion of freedom let's not lose it for party sake.
I think what Rt was trying to relay is that you may not be able to vote for Conservatives in primaries. Depends on the State.
Don't you guys realize that you are the problem, you bunch of non-thinking, redneck rubes? I mean, come on! You should just submit to party leadership. They know what's best for you. Every time you begin thinking for yourselves you start mucking things up. Let the oligarchs at the head of the GOP make the decisions and just be good subjects/party members. They'll throw you a bone now and then, don't worry. And they sure aren't as bad as those evil Democrats.
NO, MR. TUOHEY, YOU ARE WRONG. YOU DON'T GET IT. YOUR KIND OF THINKING IS THE PROBLEM, NOT THE SOLUTION. WE WILL NOT BE TAKEN FOR GRANTED ANY LONGER. YOU WILL GOVERN CONSTITUTIONALLY OR YOU WILL NOT GET OUR VOTE. WE NO LONGER PONY UP FOR THOSE WHO DO NOT REPRESENT US.
Damn straight.
Ya wanna see what happens when you screw your base in an effort to curry favor with the left: Whitness the downfall of popular governor Charlie Crist. Once eyed for the VP slot under McCain, now he may not be the shoe in for the Senate position he is vying for. http://apnews.myway.com/article/20091025/D9BI3EJ8...
Agree with All.
You DC elitist folks don't get who the Tea Partiers are. I took my family to 9/12 DC to teach my family what PATRIOTS do when the country is under assault either foreign or DOMESTIC.
The truth be known – we HATE politics. We want to be left alone.
NY-23 is a battle. It may turn out like bunker hill – we might lose. However, in loss the early patriots shell shocked the Brits and taught themselves how to battle the oppressive Brits. Same deal in 2009. NY-23 is our Bunker Hill & we're playing to win. Virginia is our Trenton of 1776.
Guess what, we're going to win, options for the Republican establishment – this is not a crack-up this is a CRACK-DOWN. This is Patton unleashed in Europe. We're not stopping at Berlin either to let teh communists take it and divide Europe fpr generations. We're in this to win for generations. There will be no socialists left when this movement completes. We're not stopping at 2012 – we're going to remove socilists for teh next 10 cycles. Period.
That was an absolutely brilliant statement. A +1 for you!
Does the GOP really want to die on RINO hill?
What nearly everyone else said, with one caveat: "All politics is local" is an important point to keep in sight. Almost all US House & Senate candidates cut their teeth in state bodies, often after stints with municipal or other local boards and offices. We all need to pay attention to these elected fledglings, support and encourage the "good" ones and weed out the other kind before they head for D.C.
UHHH excuse me I think the costitution has already been broken the Dems locked the Repubs out of their meeting thats bi-partisian they are demanding we take flu shots and who the hell elected the Czars thats from Russia not here and my friend your kids won’t be fight this one we will be within a year do you honestly think this Communist faction is goin to give up power uhhhhhhh not unless we physically remove them and why has congress got a block on Obamas Birth Certificate if he were a real Citizen that shouldn’t be a problem the other presidents could and don’t give me that forged jive he showed the press show us the long form and how did he fly to Indoniesa what passport did he use because we had a no fly zone
Republicans need to get their act together. I had thought about an Independent Republican party, like Lieberman's ID, that could caucus with Reps. Then again, I would also like to see conventions as they used to be BUT that would exclude such IR candidates. Before we go supporting multiple candidates/parties remember how our second election in 1796 went. Electoral votes, 138 – each voting two choices:
John Adams……………71
Thomas Jefferson……68
Thomas Pinckney……59
Aaron Burr………………30
Scattering……………….48
Then again we don't want to repeat the mistakes of the 11th election:
James K. Polk, D….170
Henry Clay, Whig…..105
The Abolition Party cast a considerable vote, and as they were former Whigs, would have been enough to have elected Clay.
After these and the lessons of Clinton, Bush, Perot, Dole and the fact that we must overthrow a fascist regime, I'll stick with my first statement. Republicans need to get their act together.
The problem is NOT with the protesters. It is within the GOP leadership (an obvious contradiction in terms)
Exactly what have they been doing while Obama has been out playing thug in chief? Not a damned thing. There is a power vacuum on the right and the good old boys had better pull their heads out of their asses and stop telling us to sit down and shut up. They need us more than we need them and the sooner they acknowledge that, the better.
Another brilliant statement through quote! A +1 to you!
Another BRILLIANT statement! More +1 for you!
Huzzah!
If you are a conservative, and the middle wins, you've won nothing.
Patrick Tuohey:
Sir, you are receiving a notice.
For far too long, we have held our noses and pulled levers, pushed buttons, whatever, for politicians who stood just right of a leftist. We did that in the vain hope of protecting our rights and our property and our persons from further encroachment by government. We did this time after time after time…
Where are we now, sir? Have we moved right, or further left? Have you noticed the citizens here have written about a political "end of days", where the Obama Administration moves to a "National Emergency", to cement themselves to power for all time?
I am not an alarmist, sir, but even my eternal optimism has been given pause…
Who will stand against this tide, sir? McCain? Snowe? Collins? Specter? Even recently, McCain once more extended his "collegiate" bona fides to "work" with those who seek to chain up the Citizenry, a team of animals under one whip. Snowe dances on television and print, the center of attention, and waffles as well as a Kerry, to stand with before she stands opposed, (at least according to the devious MSM). Specter, a miracle of modern medical treatment, would he give up his plan to stand and be counted amongst us and our government sanctioned leeches, bloodletting, and trepanation?
The line is drawn, sir. We stand here, and no force in Heaven or on Earth will move us. We stand with Adams, Aurelius, Jefferson, Madison, Franklin, and a long line of others; even to Ronald Wilson Reagan.
We will no longer be counted amongst those who forge the chains that we will wear. We will be bloodied, but we will not submit. We will be beaten, but we will stand tall. We may even die for our principles, but we will live on forever in the hearts and minds of free men and women.
The line is drawn. This far. NO further. We will take our country back. It will once more belong to the PEOPLE.
Stand where you wish, sir. I stand with my fellows against tyranny, and oppression, and servitude to government.
I will stand for FREEDOM!
Well written and BRAVO! +
[...] The rest is here: Tea Party Dilemma: Honey, I Shrunk the Party [...]
Since at least 1996, The Republican leadership has lost all enthusiasm for everything except getting elected.
There were guys like Newt Gingrich, who promoted things like "The Contract with America" and then proceeded to wipe himself with it…
And then there was the braindead, bonehead "Thinking" that gave us presidential candidates like Bob Dole and John S. McCain…
There seems to be a wall between right-leaning voters and the leadership of the Republican party…
Mr. Tuohey, TEAR DOWN THIS WALL
HA-ha! I keep getting calls from Newt's office. I told them "no dice" unless he straightens up and represents true Conservatism as he once did. They don't call me anymore.
Excellent! Quoting the Great Communicator is always a winner with me.
Sorry, you lost me at the "I supported Buchanan in 1992" statement…
Also, nothing politically in 1992 could ever begin to compare with 21st century politics. 1992 or 1882 – just about the same when you're living in the 24/7 blog-driven politics we have today.
Ditto
I will stand with you Mjolnir for Liberty. If the 500 elitist country club RINO GOP in NRCC and NRP want to stand against the the Millions of 9/12ers let them. When the national republicans won't support the right of center candidates with the money we send them, let them eat cake.
When people like Patrick Tuohey tell us to support Democrats that place an R behind their name. I ask who is the one really out to destroy the party, Rino's or Conservatives? When Rino's tell us to support the "No Principle Party" Cap and Tax, Tarp supporting bailout RINO's I say support a Democrat at least they are honest Marxists.
NutsnBolts, thank you for the shout-out. I love this site, and not just for the main posts. There are some very astute commenters, and I always feel that I've learned something from what I've read here.
HAMMER it HOME, sister!
TRUTH has been spoken here. Nothing to add.
A +1 to you!
Excellent point, well put, Dan!
If the Republican party wants my vote and my money they will demonstrate the values I hold dear. As evidenced by Pres. Bush, Govs Huckabee and Romney, the Republicans don't hold my values.
I want the government out of my life, out of the lives of my family and kids. I don't want to give them the money I work so hard for. Pres. Bush and the others made the government worse not better in these regards. So it doesn't matter if the damocrats win seats if the republicans grow the gvt. like the damocrats.
Support the Tea Parties. Teach the big government republicans that if they want power, they must do what we want. Nothing else is going to change the course of the country.
Killer bad — Way to GO!
RINOs can kiss my WFA!
Mjolnir, you ain't wrong and you sure as HELL ain't lyin'!!
Preach it, love it, live it!
"My first significant political activity was on behalf of Pat Buchanan in the 1992 Republican primary in New Hampshire against a sitting Republican president. You may remember how that ended: Buchanan lost the primary, and President Bush lost the general election.
That election saw another significant split among conservatives. Ross Perot earned the votes of one-fifth of the electorate. While he did less well in 1996 (8%), he significantly split fiscal conservatives from Republicans. Bill Clinton never achieved 50% of the vote in either election–but took office nonetheless."
Then in 2008, the GOP ran a moderate media darling, a uniter if ever there was one, John McCain. And he got his clock cleaned by a shinyhopeychangey ornament from the Chicago machine. Third party may not be the answer but RINO's aren't either.
You knocked that out of the ballpark!
Newt did wipe himself with the contract for America, the rubbed our noses in it. He is a typical politician. They are despicable. We need new, fresh blood.
AWESOME!
That's the kind of passion I feel, too, when someone tells me to go along and get along. Going along and getting along is WHAT GOT US HERE!!!
Excellent thoughts, well said, thank you very much.
You brought tears to my eyes with this comment. I feel lucky as hell that this site is here, and the great writers and commenters, as well.
What a helluva piece of writing that was, Mjolnir. Thank you, thank you.
Part of the current problem, is that politicians cite the 24/7 newscycle. The endless loop of cable news. Yet they love it, it gives them a chance 24/7 to make headlines, and get facetime. Further than the 24/7 newscycle, is the Perpetual Campaign. The campaign never ends, it is constant. Every politician is looking two, four and six years out; constantly posturing for position, jockeying for the pole position. It is endless, and is driven by dollars. The political campaigns are one of the largest cottage industries in America. Beyond cottage industries, they are big business.
Hey… wanna send a real message? CHange your registration to NPA or independent. That'll get them to thinking.
Oh, and don;t fall for the "wasting your vote" gas… it ain't true!
The problem is that the RNC has been backing liberal republicans in PRIMARIES, like Governor Crist in Florida, when there are true conservative candidates running as well. That is not right.
I have a loose hierarchy of needs for candidates depending on the position they go for. Like – I am always – no matter what for smaller government. For Congressional and presidential candidates – the next is \”no wimps need apply\” meaning strong defense and active foreign policy. For my local politician for city council… meh.
Last year's Presidential election made me ill. And then this situation with massive government interference and take over. It just further cements my libertarian roots. Give me term limits and a ditching of any bill that creeps over 500 pages and I will die a happy girl.
— On Sun, 10/25/09, IntenseDebate Notifications <notifications@intensedebatemail.com> wrote:
Patrick, I cannot begin to express the dissapointment that I have after seeing someone make reference to Monty Python, and then discover that the underlying article is so terribly misguided even to the extent of not being funny.
The lesser of Two Evils Argument: It's thinking like this that contributes to the erosion of basic goodness and morality. If we can't get a candidate who doesn't support the exact same things as Obama, then there is NO point in defeating the Big O. I would rather see the Democratic Party continue to demonstrate it's willingness to urinate on the constitution and have public opinion turn against them before I would vote for a Republican Candidate, just to see them end up doing the same thing.
One thing is for sure, If the best the republican's can do in 2012 is someone like Romney, then I'm voting for a 3rd party candidate.
one word to sum up the notion that we have to take what the GOP shoves us – Bullshit!!! I have never registered with any party, but have not voted for a Democrat since Sam Nunn quit running for US Senate. I have given money to certain politicians, but never to a party. I ONLYi vote for for conservatives. If the GOP doesn't present a conservative, I don't vote. The only exception I have made is for McCain last November, b/c I knew Obama was a hard-core leftist/socialist, and I had to hold my nose to do that (although Sarah Palin's presence on the ticket made me feel a little better). If I lived in NY-23, my vote would go to Hoffman. Screw this big tent nonsense. We are at a point in this country where conservatives must take a stand and not kow-tow to or subordinate their principles to nonsensical tacticians like Tuohey and Gingrich (what a disappointment). Sure, there is eventually a point where some compromises must be made, but that's next year, not now. Plus, why would anyone trust Scozzafava to do anything she says. Someone like Leiberman, yes. Scozzafava, give me a break.
How about a God fearing poliitician? Does it matter what he/she is registered if he/she really has God and Country at heart? If he or she actually read the consituton and the Bible. Our Country was buildt on God, it needs to go back to this. A Represenative that actually fears the Lord. That actually cares about the people he represents and upholds the consitutuion. Why do we not have any Abraham, George now?? Look at what we do have, an Obama who is out to be the ruler of the world and doesn't care who he steps on or kills to get his way.
F_CK THE GOOD-OLE-BOY NETWORK
much better to have a cohesive group than one polluted with non-cons. If we do not stand on principles and convictions we are no better than the dems
Dede is not only worse than your ordinary RINO, but her husband is a big UNION GUY.
Learn whgere and when it's time to fight; this is one of the rare times to do so.
Newtie moved leftwards long ago; a decade ago, actually.
Exactly, what a reckless article from a feckless opinion piece writer. We're sick of Republican party as much as we are the Democrats. At least the Democrats are intellectually honest about their lust for the blood of innocent children (born and unborn) and elderly "burdens". They are also honest about their love of taxing the citizens to death and their Marxist role models.
The Republican party is exactly the same, except they lie about it. Somehow, they continue to dupe the straight-ticket voters year after year. "Big Tent" Steele may as well fully endorse McCain for president again. But at least he's intellectually honest. He believes that abortion should [visibly] be part of the Republican platform and that the whole debate over same-sex "marriage" be [visibly] swept under the rug because of its "devisiveness". It figures that he spent so much time with the Franciscans during his discernment process. I have yet to meet a Franciscan that doesn't have jelly for a spine on moral issues.
The fact is, neither party represents conservative Christians and Catholics who truly follow the Church's teachings. Steele to me is just a Biden, Pelosi, Sebelius, Kmeic, etc (how many out-of-communion Catholics work for Obama now?). with an elephant brooch on his chest. My conscience will not allow me to vote Democrat, less I gravely sin, and, because of the blatant dishonesty in the Republican party, I won't vote that way either… unless they pull their heads out of their asses.
Glad to see that someone else gets it. Thanks !
In NY-23 the GOP candidate is likely more liberal than the Democrat. Explain to me how this woman even got the support of any Republican officials to get the place on the ballot?
I don't give a crap if they lose the election. If she wins – it is just another Democrat vote anyway.
[...] I SHRUNK THE PARTY: No one’s expecting an Inquisition, though. But then, nobody ever does . . [...]
I have to say that I like what I am reading. Stand up America. We will fix this problem…one CONSERVATIVE at a time. Our party has left us…not the other way around.
As one who remembers the early nineties ground game quite well, it's great to see all these positive comments.
Mr. Tuohey failed to mention that Br. Buchanan also ran as an Independent in '96, from the ballot spot generated via '92 campaign.
That my friends, is also the key. Much has changed since then, and both 'sides' made darn sure the next 3rd Party movement would be an exercise in futility, at the National level.
So yes, the end game would be to a coalescence within a section of the existing duopoly at the national level. While helping all we can in races like NY 23.
Yeah, the RNC have every incentive in the world to hope we go away. It's like Barry disparaging Fox News.
Scozzafava is against secret ballots for union elections. That's a deal-breaker regardless of party.
I say back the values or split the party. We tried the moderate tactics and the Democrats got in anyway.
I don't understand what "cliff" a number of posters think that the US is headed for; mostly, they don't tell what they think will happen.
Any kind of cliff has to be pretty extreme. For instance, it could be a state of anarchy, the dissolution of the United States, or the assumption of power by Nazis or Communists. Is that what they expect? And if they do expect a similar catastrophe, why aren't they emigrating, assuming they can afford to?
It's just confusing.
Wow I thought I had found a great new website here at Big government. Then I read this flaming piece of refuse. Get a clue Rhinotard. The Republicans can either get back to conservative principles on all levels or lose again and again. Perot did not cost you the election, Socialist Globalist Bush 1 did that. And now you're paying for his son. Just when it can't get any better a bunch of elitist moronic high school glee club buddies get in the New York Republican's back room and nominate someone to the left of the democrat. And we're just suppose to eat it again. No More, No Way. Mr. Tuohey please go back to Huffington or Kos you Plant, at least for Breibart I hope you are a plant.
If we do not stand for our principles and keep to our core beliefs then we stand for nothing. RINOS stand for nothing. McCain stood in the way with his gang of 8 when we had a chance to make a lasting difference in the courts, the hell with the man. He and the others need to go. No on Cap and Trade, No on the Health Care, No to more Bail outs, No to more Stimulus. When it comes to standing against the democretins I am proud to be the party of NO.
Thank you sybill. That's exactly what I was saying. Perhaps Joe lives in a walk up registration state. Others only allow registered party members to vote in the primary to select the party's candidate.
My suggestion is essentially that we need to reclaim the party. Get more involved; change the direction. Be the change you see needs to be made.
I agree we should get as many truly conservative candidates as we can elected to office. The Republican Party allowed itself to compromise its conservative principles during the Bush years, spending like there was no tomorrow.
The story is, why elect Republican Lite, who's going to spend like a Democrat, when you can vote for the Democrat and get the whole thing. This is a great time to support the Conservative candidate instead of the Republican, in New York, and what a shake-up it would be for all politics in the country if the conservative won. It would almost be better than sex.
What does "small government" mean in this day and age?
Looking at the nation's real expenses, I have to assume that people who want "small government" would, first of all, get rid of Medicare, Social Security, and Medicaid. Those are major expenditures in our budget. If those programs were eliminated, government would be a lot smaller. I wonder what small government enthusiasts hope would happen to the poor and the elderly.
Of course, the government can also get "smaller" by privatizing such services as the military, post office, and federal police forces, such as the FBI and the CIA. Of course, even if such actions are taken, the people who privately provide these services would still have to be paid.
First of all: if a RINO consistently votes against her own party, then doesn't that mean the voters have effectively elected a D, even if she has an R behind her name? So how, exactly, are true Republican constituents represented in this scenario?
Second: If conservatives revolt now and send a very clear and unmistakable message to the GOP that we want true conservatives being supported by the state and local parties, then it seems that this is the time to make that case, when the outcome really doesn't change the current order of things. Let me put it another way: The democrats already have a majority in the house, so the D candidate winning this three-way race doesn't cost the Republicans anything. But it will serve as a very important message to the GOP to select better candidates from here on out. And that, to me, is a legitimate message for the conservative base to be sending the GOP.
Your argument only works if this is a major election — one of the governor races or the 2010 mid-terms — but it doesn't hold water for this interim election. Now is the perfect time to make this stand!
How about we start "smaller government" by not adding another huge social debacle (HC) to the big three? You know what they say, when you are in a hole…….
Amen!
I was always a registered Republican. Last month, I changed my voter registration to "No Party Affiliation." I will never, ever donate to the RNC again. I'm only going to choose candidates who I am not allergic to. You see, I've developed this intense allergy to HYPOCRISY.
If a faux Republican (RINO, DIABLO, whatever) gets elected and then turns out to be exactly as feared, just Democrat lite, then it may well encourage fiscal conservatives — whatever their actual registered party affiliation might be, including none — to finally vote for true fiscally conservative candidates. In other words, a third party which promotes fiscal conservatives suddenly becomes more politically viable. If the country continues on its downward path, then this is an even more likely outcome.
If the GOP continues to foist crappy Dem-lite candidates on us, it will hasten their own demise as a viable political entity. And I doubt there will be many conservativs who will weep at the GOP's demise…
If RNC wants their candidates supported by most republicans, they should select real republicans — not pseudos.____More and more folks (even "members" of a party) are obviously paying attention to the individual candidate, not the hack with a party label, to see what principles that candidate represents. Parties failing to reflect and adhere to a core set of principles in selecting candidates can't expect to have all their candidates accepted by all its party's members.____In NY23rd, for the issues of card-check and a three-quarter trilion dollar stimulus-to-nowhere, it is impossible to view the Republican candidate as really and truly "fiscally responsible" since she supports both of those "pillars" of the Democrat Party's agenda. RNC itself has therefore not been "fiscally responsible" in supporting that candidate____With the economy sinking lke a stone, why would RNC want to vote in more pseudo-republicans who are willing to pile on more debt and hamstring economic growth with card check manacles when there is another choice in NY23rd?____It's inexplicable, and not really practical either when there is a viable alternative running in the same election.
It's not a dilemma. It's a feature. The republooters would be on the same exact path with regard to the worlds largest looting of an economy as Obama is on if they had won. Ron Paul was never a real option. The looting under Bush's last few months was hyper-ludicrous, and stupid old McCain was completely clueless. Make no mistake the bailouts would have been just as bad under the currently electable republicans. Had McCain won then he too would have pulled in a bunch of economic dolts to advise him to turn on the money machine, keep interest rates at near zero, and bail out anyone with political clout.
RIGHT ON.
yeah, the republicans have done such a great job the past few years, wouldn't you say?
The problem is not just the rinos, the problem is that what the party considers mainstream republican is not conservative enough (and or too corrupt and too willing to try to buy votes with taxpayer's money, et cetera). We can all try to push the party to be more conservative [in general] without targeting rinos that are already in office. The special election that has everyone upset, the candidate didn't have to be a left wing republican to win but thats what the party leaders put up.
Social Security and other benefits programs would have to be phased out over time, when those who are currently drawing benefits no longer are, thus fulfilling our promise to them.
Military is a legitimate function of government and as such, would still exist. This is also true for the FBI and CIA, though the case could probably be made that the two could possibly be combined and streamlined.
But the Post Office's work can be done by the private sector and should be. The Department of Education could be closed tomrrow and no one would miss it. Why do we need a Department of Agriculture when most work could be done on the county/state level? Why do we have National Forests and National Parks?
No program is improved or made cheaper when the federal government oversees it. It's time to start taking some pruning shears to Big Government.
in case you haven't noticed, things were pretty awful with republicans in control. you have people like lindsay graham who support cap and trade, along with all the other PROGRESSIVE republicans, who are willing to compromise on every value they have, just so they can say "hey, we got something done!"
but what they don't tell you is that they are spending us into oblivion, and they couldn't care less… as long as they get re-elected.
d's and r's are the SAME thing. you have to take a stand and vote on your principles at some point. Voting based on some stupid party affiliation, rather than voting on your principles, is what i would call throwing your vote away.
so yeah, keep voting against something, rather than for something… that will perpetuate the cycle of crap thats been going on… yeah that will really make things better. TIME TO WAKE UP.
What does the term "big tent" mean? A tent is supposed to keep something out — like those elements that are harmful to the inhabitants of the tent. The GOP should not stop debate about what means to achieve results. But values, there's the rub. Do you support someone who believes in big government solutions most of the time? I don't think so. Should they then allow liberals, who believe in big government, as the solution almost everythng to be inside the tent? No, that would be contradictory to conservative values. When Tom Delay said that they cut the budget to the bone, we all laughed. And now the old losers of the GOP wants more clowns in the tent. Sorry, it is not the circus type of big tent. It is about upholding traditional,constitutionally supported values. So the heck with the dilution of our values. Let's take back the GOP.
Obviously, you too "political" to notice this FACT.
"The Republican Party has a choice. They can continue to antagonize those who vote them into office or they can start paying attention. They mistakenly buy the D.C. bubble philosophy that moderation is the way to find good candidates. What they’re seeing is a base WILLING TO LOSE if the Republican Party doesn’t change its ways."
Melissa Clouthier at Pajamas Media
Without principles, we are ALREADY LOSING by the actions of the herd of RINO's loose in DC and state capitols. The Republican party is making no difference so why continue to support people who stab you in the back?
I'm not interested in providing jobs for Republicans. I'm interested in advancing the PRINCIPLES that Ronald Reagan stood for. No principles, no vote. It's that simple. I don't give a s**t if ALL "Republican (RINO)" office holders get a personal introduction to the unemployment line. Bye, Bye.
You say "Don't make the good the enemy of the perfect." Fair enough.
Describe how Dede Scozzafava, honored by Planned Parenthood, supporter of the bailouts, the "stimulus" package, the Employee "Free Choice" Act, and who has run for office previously on the Working Families Party ticket (a wholly-owned subsidiary of ACORN) — describe how she is the "good" in ANY way…except keeping those nasty upstart small-government types out in flyover country out of the rarified corridors of power where the Blue Blood Country Club Republicans belong.
I'll wait.
I have two words for you Patrick:
John McCain.
I rest my case.
This is our warning to all so-called conservative politicians: Straighten the hell up and fly right, or face the consequences. We're sick of carrying your water as you fall further and further out of touch with us. And if you think we're the ones who won't fall in line, you're in for a nasty surprise.
RINO isn't an accurate enough label. How about CINO for Conservative In Name Only? Or maybe we modify one of Mark Steyn's suggestions and call them DIABLos — Democrats In All But Label…
Uh, Patrick? If the tea parties do indeed sow the seeds of defeat for the Republican Party, seriously—how would we know?
We need a Liberal Capitalist Party to replace the Republicans. It’s not enough to be conservative. what it’s really about is what it is that needs be conserved: human freedom.
Patrick Tuohey, when the Constitution becomes a "market share" issue for a politician I say go join the Democrats.
"I'm trying to make sure that conservatism doesn't get hijacked by political fringes," Graham told McClatchy. "I don't want to be in a party that's consistently losing market share. Our problem is we're going to have to broaden the base of our party."
Graham believes in the art of compromise and says partisan politics can't create jobs, reverse climate change, provide good health care or address other major concerns.
"At the end of the day, I believe that in Delaware and Connecticut and Illinois and Nevada, we're going to have to recruit candidates with a broader appeal," Graham said
Graham infuriated conservative activists two weeks ago by co-authoring a New York Times column on climate change with Sen. John Kerry of Massachusetts, the 2004 Democratic presidential nominee.
Graham and Kerry sketched a potential compromise with Democrats allowing offshore oil drilling and new nuclear power plants, and Republicans recognizing the urgency of global warming and accepting caps on carbon emissions from big factories and power plants.
Appearing before agitated constituents in Greenville the next day, amid yells of "Traitor!" and shouted demands to switch parties, Graham responded:
"We're not going to be the party of angry white guys."
Mr. Tuohey,
Please head for the doors and vote with the Democrats. By kicking out the corrupt, unprincipled liberals you wish to lead us, we remove their power. If only dedicated conservatives are left in the GOP apparatus, then they will support other conservatives.
A more principled GOP would never have “selected” Ms. Scozzafava (sp?). They would have selected a conservative candidate and would have avoided this situation to begin with.
So basically what you are recommending is that we just stay on the slippery slope? Why not get off the slope all together and stand up for decency and what is right? Your article is akin to Nancy Pelosi not going after Charlie Rangle because she is scared of pissing off people in her own party. What ever happened to doing what is right over doing what is politically expedient.
… when the dems disallow a conservative dem from speaking we squawk about how awful they are to censor voices in their own party.. but let a moderate or, god forbid, a liberal show up in the GOP then it's time to get out the torches and pitchforks to destroy the 'RINO'.
i thought that what a republican supported was smaller government, lower taxes, individual liberty, and free enterprise.. but that somehow isn't enough to pass the muster anymore. now there appears to be some kind of far-right, religiously-influenced litmus test for what makes a 'true conservative' and, therefore, acceptable to be a member of the republican party. i don't see much hope in third parties, but i know that that is not the kind of republican party that i can continue to support … so now what ?
Still trying to get conservatives to eat that crap sandwich, eh?
Hear Hear, other commenters. What do we gain by having a bunch of Specters, Snowes or McCains with Rs after their names? These are big spenders that do not hesitate to step on the Constitution. NY23 is House but the same principle holds. When the Rs are just as bad as the Ds what exactly is lost when the D wins? The current structures reflect 70 year old systems set by Dems that Rs have done too little to dismantle and rather seem to enjoy too much. Enough.
However, note the interesting graphic in this post in re unemployment rates under D or R Senates:
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2009/10/graph...
Beware that the US employment statistics are pretty bogus with the adjustments and assumptions and all the other book cooking (e.g., if someone is discouraged and stops looking for a job, viola he or she is no longer unemployed). Pretty compelling but not enough to elect numerous RINOs or, worse, DIABLOs (Democrats In All But Name Only). (Thanks Mr. Steyn for this excellent acronym. You should get a sidelight naming Federal legislation). Regards,
This country is headed for complete fiscal collapse, a route it's been heading for decades now. I see no reason to vote for anyone who won't work to reverse that process. Not just slow it down. Not just try to compromise or appease it. Not just try to siphon off votes who support it, or try to steer the funnymoney towards a certain interest group.
I'd no sooner vote for someone who tolerates this fiscal madness that I would, were I transported back to 1850, vote for someone who tolerates slavery or secession. And make no mistake–the injustices being done to productive peoples' right to contract and hold property are just as morally loathsome, and pose just as much threat to this country's future, as slavery does.
And let me be even more blunt. If our present Constitution doesn't allow us a way to vote for statesmen who will stop government overspending and overcontrol of capital, then I don't see our present constitution surviving for much longer. Nor do I see any particular reason why it should.
The early 20th Century was the swan song for aristocratic excess and depredations. Here's to hoping the early 21st century is the beginning of the end for socialist, statist ill-governance. Hopefully with less bloodshed.
Yes, and I'm sure some very earnest Whigs were saying much the same thing right around 1858. It's axiomatic, of course, that the worst Republican is (in general) better than the best Democrat. However, it is also usually the case that,given the choice between a liberal Republican and a liberal Democrat, the electorate seems to opt for the Demo. Who knows why; in any case, it may well be time to stand on principle, at least in NY-23. We'll just have to take this on a case-by-case basis.
This article was a satire, right Patrick?
Patrick?
MR. TUOHEY!!!???
Haven't you heard?
Obama is cutting Medicare. Not conservatives.
Obama is not embracing employment, so there is no money for Social Security, (like there ever was any anymore).
Medicaid is defunct under Obamacare. But rationing won't be. Want to get specialized care, like ulcerative colitis, under Obamacare? Suck steroids until your body dies off, because we won't pay for the expensive stuff. And innovation? Fugeddaboutit. That takes cash, and there ain't any in this turkey.
Post Office? Online bill pay and email are putting this buggy-whip manufacturer out of business. If they can't find a new business model, the dinosaur will, and should, die off. I will miss all those ads for carpet cleaning, though. I use them to get my fireplace going.
Take a giant pair of scissors to the education budget, I bet you could pull enough cash out for F-22's and a couple more Navy ships. Put some nuns in charge of it, they all know how to get a kid an education cost-effectively.
The EPA is a monster desperately in need of neutering. I'll bring the knife; and we start in the central valley of California…
"…brevity is the soul of wit…"
A +1 to you!
I had decided not to vote at al rather than vote for McCain. However, the more I found out about Obama's background, the more I was convinced that McCain would be far better in many ways, as much as I dislike his need to be the center of everything and compromise on important priniciples. I knew how my state would vote, so I really didn't need to vote, but my basic sense of civic duty convinced me to vote for the lest objectionable.
If I were in NY-23, I'd vote for Mr. Hoffman, since I don't see that much difference between Scozzafava and the Democrat, but in general, I think that third party movements are only a good thing if they draw votes from the Democrats. If they stand to draw votes from Republicans, I couldn't support them.
Well yes. We should suffer while evils are sufferable. When they are not we may need to increase suffering to decrease evil.
I think there was a famous document that once made that point. And a civil war leading to a revolution fought on that principle.
I'm told there is a certain Country that celebrates that civil war every July 4th.
But the Democrat running is more Republican than the Republican.
Ironic, isn't it, when someone like Zell Miller says "The Democrat Party left me" the GOP elites nod sagely and applaud his independence, noting that if only those lefty Dems could regain their roots in Scoop Jackson they would be better off. Then when Republicans walk out saying, just as correctly, that the Republican party has left Reaganite principles, they are denounced and told their efforts are destructive.
If the elites who support DIABLOs (Steyn's Democrat in all but label only) like Scozzafava (not once but in three levels of the GOP) would only listen (they seem to think tea partiers who denounce Dems are good, teabaggers who denounce the GOP are bad!), perhaps they could keep the party from splitting. The national (and many state) GOP groups seek reconciliation like Obama seeks bipartisanship – we will get together in compromise when you agree with us.
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Bingo! Upding!
I voted for Perot. We got Clinton. Not only did I have no regrets, I was happy: I voted against, "Read my lips" while I lie Bush, and he lost.
Mission accomplished.
I will continue to vote for Libertarian candidates – and the new Conservative Party looks spiffy too – whenever there is a RINO or an otherwise unprincipled Republican on the ticket.
The quotation I'd offer as an exclamation to yours is, "Virtue is its own reward."
I will no longer take part in plugging my nose and voting for the lesser of two evils. I will vote for REAL honesty and integrity from here on out! Let the cards fall as they may…so be it.
Please sir, do not lump all Franciscans into the same heap. I am a Franciscan and I can honestly tell you I have never met a Franciscan who WASN"T a staunch pro-lifer and traditional marriage believer. It would seem to me that most politicians forget their Catholic values as evidenced by the Kennedy's.
I agree with you that we need more true Christians in the Republican Party. Not only those who pay lip service to their faith, but live it within their own lives and in their politics. This great Country would be far better off if we got back to the Judeo-Christian ethic our Founding Fathers had.
Time will tell. Till then I pray for the salvation of this Nation.
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Yes. By all means the GOP needs more Arlen Spectors, Jim Jeffords and Olympia Snowes. Everyone knows they are the true Republicans. Except, of course, when, you know, they become Democrats or vote to limit political free speech like McCain/Feingold.
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BREAKING LOGIC ! What the RINO's fail to grasp is that if they are NOT supported and lose elections maybe ONE DAY they will understand it's their positions that made them lose…not the voting electorate ! And when they DO lose, upright and Constitutional candidates will start to DOT the political landscape and give voters what they seek for this great country !
Stop the compromising with our freedoms and inalienable RIGHTS !
BREAKING LOGIC ! What the RINO's fail to grasp is that if they are NOT supported and lose elections maybe ONE DAY they will understand it's their positions that made them lose…not the voting electorate ! And when they DO lose, upright and Constitutional candidates will start to DOT the political landscape and give voters what they seek for this great country !
Stop the compromising with our freedoms and inalienable RIGHTS !
I want the two Republicans out of Maine. They are much better than the D’s we would have had out of Maine. Okay?
This isn't true in the New York race, though. Dede isn't "squishy", she isn't "moderate"… she's full blown liberal moonbat and it would literally be better to have the D in that chair than her.
How about a moto? FIRE THEM ALL.
This is the same arguement we've been getting from the Republican Party for decades now:
"VOte for our scummy, corrupt candidate or a Democrat might get the seat!"
It's an attempt to blackmail voters by their own patriotism.
It's foul, it's corrupt, and it cost me any respect I might have had for you, Mr. Tuohey.
Go tell your RNC paymasters to kiss my ass.
What difference does the size of the party make if you increasingly fill it with those who have more in common with the Democratic Party’s platform than the GOP’s?
I really don’t give a flip about the GOP’s woes. They flushed their majorities down the toilet by governing as Democrat Lite and now they speak out of both sides of their mouths by saying they’ve learned lessons while supporting more RINOs.
Screw ‘em. Our country and our freedom along with it are rapidly circling the drain and I will NOT give one more dime or one more vote to anyone who will further enslave us to big government simply because the alternative is worse.
I admit it. As a Conservative, I am playing "chicken" with the Republican party by not voting for RINOS. They better swerve out of the way first…..cause I'm not gonna.
Mike
If they're so worried about splitting the vote, they should dump the RINO and endorse Hoffman. Why should WE have to bow down to the wisdom of the GOP power structure?
It is absolutely maddening how the blame for Clinton's win is continuously blamed on Perot. Perot did not cause the Republicans to lose the election, the GOP did. If the GOP had run a candidate that was more reflective of the American people then there would not have been a Perot factor. It should not be forgotten that Perot ran as an Independent because the GOP refused to back him in his initial bid AS A REPUBLICAN. The vote was split because of the two party generated 'support the party' mentallity. If you insist on continuing to blame Perot for Clinton's Presidency then you should also blame the Green Party for W. Bush.
Right on! We need to think beyond the next 2-4 years, or else our children will ask us what it was once like in America when people were free.
“By picking a fight within the GOP and calling for an inquisition against RINOs, Tea Party activists are sowing the seeds of all our defeat.”
Oh, and that really sticks in my craw.
You go tell the GOP that picking a fight with their base and trying to marginalize conservatives is sowing the seeds of all our defeat. Don’t tell me the fault is mine for refusing to hold my nose and having had enough of the big spending, big government, anti-liberty Republicrats.
I agree. If the GOP is so worried about handing the election to the Democrats, they should support Hoffman. Sanders and Lieberman (both independents) caucus with the Democrats. Should Hoffman get elected (which he would be if the GOP would dump the RINO), he would surely caucus with the Republicans. The Republicans get an ally, and keep the seat from going to the Democrats. Win/Win
It's obvious the current GOP cares nothing about liberty or freedom. They're goals are the same as the Democrats. I say it's time for a regime change in the GOP.
Comment after comment has noted the extreme lack of fiscal responsibility of our current set of politicians, and the fiscal disaster that is upon us. And you are wondering if there is a 'cliff'? What an eedjut.
Did all old people die untended without medical care or the necessities of life before Medicare? Just wondering. What did poor people do before Social Security? Oh yeah, they moved to another city and got a job. I remember now. Got any more pro-socialist arguments you need flaying, Rick?
Sorry, but as far as I am concerned, Bill Owens winning NY-23 is a good thing. Not because of who he is, but because the GOP might actually wake up and realize that without the conservatives, they wont win a single seat anywhere in the country. Good. When the members realize that, maybe they'll wake up and get rid of the elitists running the party and give it back to the people to whom it belongs!
NEITHER party honors and upholds the Constitution of the United States. Patrick, your argument would hold water if the GOP offered an option that was substantively different, in practice, than the Democrats, but they don’t. Both parties are corrupt, both are happy to run this country into the ground and scr3w the taxpayers, they just mouth different rhetoric while they do it.
We may be witnessing the last opportunity to put America back on the course the Founding Fathers envisioned. If that means a period of turmoil and the destruction of the GOP, too fricking bad. There are more important things than which party holds Congress during the next few years — like whether our children will inherit a country that protects personal liberty, for instance!
So, if we vote for the "independent" candidate who represents our values, maybe the 'D's will control the committee leadership, but they won't be able to count on the independents' votes on the floor. I used to think the 'R' after a candidate's name meant something, but not anymore.
The proper term is “don’t make the perfect the enemy of the good”, not vice-versa. See, the ideal (the perfect) makes one adverse to the good (imperfect yet better than the bad)… so the perfect is the enemy of the good.
I think the lesson here is that the Tea Party folks don't need the GOP to make their point, but the GOP needs the Tea Party to win. So if I were the GOP, instead of trying to convince the Tea Party folks to get along, I'd be doing my damndest to figure out what the Tea Party people want, and whatever it is, that's what I'm gonna do.
The article makes sense only if the purpose of voting was to see a particular party win. If the purpose is to see a particular line of policy followed, the the writer's suggestion is simply idiotic.
I cannot stand one more minute of drinking the cool-aide for some slob RINO who sill piss all over us every chance he gets. If we have to win with another Spector, then we have already lost.
Spot on Craig. Enough is enough. The RNC treats us like some ugly date. We are supposed to let them screw us becuase nobody else will take us to the dance. To hell with them.
I agree with what everyone is saying here. Voting for RINOs is a big part of how we got where we are. If the Republicans can't represent conservatives, who are more than 50% of the country, then a new party will have to do it instead.
Do you think that the leftys convinced Scozzofava to run so she could cause the split she is causing? You think this was an "accident"? Do you think that she is a dimwit party plant with the faux R after her name?
Youbetcha!
Good points, Craig. We don't necessarily want to challenge every RINO in every election cycle, but if we challenge the worst ones (especially those fitting Mark Steyn's label, the DIABLO, Democrat In All But Label Only), we will steer the party back toward its principles over time.
Another reason why this NY-23 special election is worth the fight is that it is a special election – even if Scozzafava stays in and prevents a win for Hoffman, Hoffman can win the primary and general in 2010.
I’m sorry, but I can’t arrive at any conclusion other that the article in a nutshell reads:
“Know your role: Vote for whom we tell you to.”
"Don't make the good the enemy of the perfect". The problem is the NY23 is not a choice between the good (Dede) and the perfect (Hoffman). Dede is not a moderate conservative — she is a liberal!
If I thought this was an honest question, I would answer it.
I wonder if it has occurred that the Buchannon and Perot voters were actually right?
The compromise he is looking for in this article is the same one that got George Bush elected in 2000. At George's first State of the union address, he called for yet another amnesty that was never suggested, and even condemned by him in the campaign. Within 3 years he jammed through that prescription drug program, a huge unfunded give away.
People that are calling for yet another compromised big government Republican can forget about the conservative vote.
RE: “don’t make the good the enemy of the perfect.”
When the Republicans put up a ‘good’ candidate, we, the unclean, disaffected conservative masses, will refrain from insisting on perfect. But c’mon.. Are you kidding? Scozzafava? It seems to me that in pushing forward this candidate, the GOP has instead made ‘keeping the power’ the enemy of the good. The GOP still doesn’t get it…
I'm an atheist and I say to hell with the RINOs.
You just need to mosey on over to the side that best suits you. We'll be fine without you.
This article is EXACTLY what is wrong with the RNC. What you thoughtful pundits and Republican strategists do not understand is that most of us ARE NOT Republicans we ARE conservatives. As long as you ignore that you will continue to garner little more than our contempt. As a person who has had the explicable Ms. Snowe as his Senator for a decade and a half + – I can say in all honesty that I an not disappointed in her vote from time to time but almost always. She sux. Susan Collins sux and if that's the best you can do you might as well stay home.
Sorry, no. If the GOP can’t put up a solid fiscal and constitutional conservative, I’ve no interest in who wins the election. The Democratic-Republicans are one Party: the Washington Party. I dare them to prove me wrong.
I see Patrick believes the "big lie" that conservatives should automatically vote for the candidate with the R behind his/her name. Dede is so far to the left that Owens is running commercials saying she's more liberal than he is.
Patrick, this woman never should have been selected to run. Why does a majority of rank and file Republicans believe that the party's leadership and Congressional Wing is out of step? Last year the NRCC withheld funds from Michele Bachmann. but it can find $200k – $300k for the last 10 days of Dede's campaign. Conservatives would be well advised to stop donating to the RNC and instead donate funds directly to deserving candidates.
Hey dummy. You screwed up the punchline! L is for label. Better luck next time.
They can't prove you wrong, Brock; hence, they won't.
What a sickening mess we're in!
"That election saw another significant split among conservatives. Ross Perot earned the votes of one-fifth of the electorate. While he did less well in 1996 (8%), he significantly split fiscal conservatives from Republicans."
…
"By picking a fight within the GOP and calling for an inquisition against RINOs, Tea Party activists are sowing the seeds of all our defeat."
You clearly did not learn the correct lesson from the Perot debacle nor can you clearly see who's picking a fight with whom. It is the centrists and moderates who are sowing the seeds of defeat by abandoning our principles and going-along-to-get-along. On the other hand, the conservative base is mobilized and ready to fight this slide into socialism. Lindsey, Newt, McCain and the rest of the panderers can either come along for the ride or help push us over the cliff along with Reid, Pelosi and our Teleprompter-in-chief.
What's it gonna be?
Just as the Gipper claimed he didn't leave the Democrat party, so too we claim we didn't leave the Republican party … the Republican party left us.
Patrick –
Since you claim to be an expert in opinion research, here's a just-released Gallup survey that indicates that voters are moving to the right.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/123854/Conservatives-M...
Did you work for the McCain campaign?
Finally, someone else who "gets it". The entire socio-cultural debate needs to change from "how fast are we going to adopt European socialism?" to "which party is going to do more to return us to Jeffersonian/Madisonian Constitutional government?" Republicans want to adopt socialism in "baby steps". The Democrats would simply impose it all at once. I would prefer the latter, so we can get on with its inevitable collapse, and the return to American Constitutionalism and federalism that was the basis for this country's beginning. When the GOP understands that principle, then we can return to supporting it. But I see no reason for being "forced" to choose the method of my country's demise – slow or fast – with threats by some that the Democrats are worse so we must vote for Republicans. In fact, we don't. We reject the very premise of the argument. I, for one, would prefer the Democrat "bullet" to the Republican "slow death by a thousand cuts". And honestly, I don't see how this country survives another 25 years. We no longer share the same values as a nation, values which are ultimately irreconcilable. Even long range Russian strategic intelligence planners give us no more than 15 years. Do they already know what we ourselves are afraid to admit?
It is the RINOs who have shrunk the party, not the Tea partiers. As Republicans grew bigger government, bigger spending, more regulations, their share of the vote has shrunk. When Republicans ran as conservatives, e.g. 1980, 1984, 1988, 1994 they won big. If the GOP leadership wants to grow the party, they'll start acting like conservatives.
So, Mr. Tuohey, you will not support Ms. Scozzafava. Neither will I, so what is your solution? You write an article to explain a problem but offer no solution. Sounds like government-speak. We need to build a strong conservative base and this is how it starts. It may take awhile but it needs to be done. Vote the bums out.
This article, and what Newt said on Fox and Friends, reminds me of the biblical story of Gideon. Gideon left with a massive army and God told him to get rid of the recently married and those who were afraid because they weren't completely comitted to the cause. What's going on right now is we are getting rid of the people who are not completely comitted to the cause of personal liberty and responsibility, the numbers may seem to go down but the odds of victory improve.
The Republican Party won't change until it loses the ridiculous notion that we must "moderate" to win elections. We need to clean house in our own party before we can hope to do so nationally.
Agree and also despise RINOs. The First priority should be stopping Obama. If we can change congress from Dem to Rep we can depose Pelosi. Then we can weed out the RINOs one by one. If we split again it'll ensure Pelosi's Win. I' ll hold my nose and vote GOP to take back Congress first . Then go after the RINOs. This will put the brakes on Comrad Obama to stop damaging America. Then rebuild……..1/3 os the Senate is up 2010. Would be good to get rid of Reid also
Their issue is that they're worried they will loose to an independent. It's amajority vote that determines the winner, not a >50% vote. If there were 3 major parties they would be worried about their 33%… it's all hogwash. The more parties we have the better… just like competition in the business world! More competition means more choices, a better streamlined and efficient vehicle that wins and LESS corporate influence because its spread throughout instead of amoung only 2.
Hey Pat! The tea party people didn't pick this fight, the GOP did. Just how many times do you get to stomp on the tiger's tail before something bad happens? Why do you think Perot got traction? Bush 41 abandoned the very conservative that put him in the Vice Presidency. It would be bad enough if they just ignored conservatives. But no, the chosen leaders of the party like Juan McAmnesty have to go out of their way to belittle and patronize conservatives at every turn. We should just "Yes Sir", "No Sir", "Thank you Sir, may I have another" all this? Ha!
Hey GOP! No money, no work, no vote. I support individual conservatives where I find them no matter what ballot line they are on. Yes, that means Hoffman. The gravy train is over.
If we want to be rid of RINO's we must get active in local party politics. Become a precinct committeeman. Run in a primary. Donate to someone you agree with. Write letters.
Last year I held my nose and voted for McCain even though I personally cannot stand the guy. I’m tired of having to choose the lesser of two evils. GOP get some rock-ribbed conservatives running for office or I’m done. Get it? We will no longer stand for Democrat-Lite candidates like McCain. Stop letting the Dems dictate what kinds of candidates the GOP needs to run. Too often in the last few years I’ve screamed at the TV and Radio because some Dem is telling the GOP what they need to do and then the GOP does it! Last time I looked the Dems were on the other side and not ours. The GOP is just as corrupt as the Dems at this point. If they won’t listen to us then it’s time to go Independant and send some messages. I live in Texas and sent money to the Hoffman campaign in NY. It starts with us folks.
…”as I learned from Morton Blackwell, “don’t make the good the enemy of the perfect.”
How about the miserable failure? Can we oppose that? Or should we simply accept the useless and worthless because there might be someone somewhere who could be worse?
If the choice were “good” that would be one thing… but “good” hasn’t been on the ballot for quite some time. The dreadfully bad, and the atrociously awful seem to be the choices… when I have trouble picking which is the lesser of the two evils; maybe the choices are the problem?
Dude, if the alternative to defeat is to elect a bunch of Scozzafava's, then by all means bring on defeat.
Hand that sword, Damocles. Hang that sword. Look up, GOP. See that sword. Get a freckin' clue.
Agree in principle with Reagan's 11th commandment; but it is WAY past time for a clear line to be drawn beyond which the national party will not cross. The examples of Jeffords, Chaffee, and Specter show us that unwavering support for RINOs has a limit.
Scozzafave doesn't even qualify as a RINO. In Mark Steyn's phrase, she's a DIABLO (Democrat in all but label only). To throw the national party's support to a candidate who's supported by ACORN, Planned Parenthood, and the SEIU is a slap in the face of those elements of the GOP and the Tea Party activists whose efforts are providing the party with the opportunity to make huge gains in off-year elections.
Remember that this is exactly what the party did back in 1996–to squander the groundswell gained by the Contract with America by nominated yet another small stupid dinosaur named Bob Dole because "it was his turn."
Democrats win because they play for keeps. Republicans had better learn to do the same.
I posted this under Doug Hoffman’s article but it bears repeating here as it is as relevant to this post as the other.
Looks like Doug Hoffman leads both the Dem and Scozzy in his race:
http://www.clubforgrowth.org/2009/10/cfg_poll_hoffman_leading_in_ny.php
Go Doug Go!
Has anyone noticed the articles in Canada Free Press, Making the Tea Party Tangible, on the subject of a conservative takeover of the Republican Party? The writer suggests that conservatives contribute to a fund which would be used to support candidates of their choice. Here is a link to the second part of this plan,(which provides a link back to the first.) Sounds logical, but maybe not doable, due to the real grass roots nature of the movement. http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/16103
Either the GOP see what WE the people want or they don’t give a damn!
If “picking a fight” with the GOP and “calling for an inquisition against RINO’S is sowing seeds of defeat” – such is a reflection on the GOP!!!! They have banked on the conservative vote for too long!
I am tired of being under the constant threat of ‘what if’. If we don’t have anymore talent left in the Nation to figure out a way, then just throw in the towel. Call it quits! It’s all over! We’re finished! I say No! If there ’s a will, there’s a way. Go for broke and keep pushing. Force their hand! Let’s see what they are really made of!
Rene beat me to posting that Hoffman now leads all candidates according to the Club For Growth poll — take that for what you will. However, if Scozzafava is the "spoiler" in the race, then she should bow out NOW. Or the GOP should encourage her to bow out. The GOP could simply say, "we misread the desires of the electorate and we won't make that mistake again."
But they won't do that, because this is all about hubris and power… they've made their choice and they'll stick with it, even if it ensures the death of their party…
Eat our own? But Scuzzywuzzy is NOT our own: she’s a Trojan Horse shill for the Demonrats served up by RINO’s.
I don’t agree. I believe that the average white guy vote is picking up steam and we are getting conservative. Get ris of the RINOs.
The promise is that if we vote for a RINO then the RINO will vote conservative AFTER the election. That is not True! The RINO votes like a Democrat. A RINO = a DEM.
I support Hoffman. Gerrymandered districts and ACORN run elections will show wins for DEMs.
What do conservatives get by including the like of Olympia Snowe, Susan Collins and Arlen Specter in the so-called "Big Tent"? Betrayal. What good does it do us if senators and congressmen like them sell us down the river on key, life-changing issues like healthcare, cap and trade, TARP, bailouts, etc. if they have an (R) next to their name? I've voted GOP my whole life, but I increasingly see the GOP as irrelevant. They seem to forget, no one will vote for a "moderate" (code for liberal) republican when they can have the real thing in a democrat. You can't out – liberal a real liberal. I understand there are times for compromise, but not when the very foundation of the country is in danger of collapse. Until and unless the GOP fields truly conservative candidates who STAND for principal, count me out. Oh and the "big tent"? May that bitch go up in flames.
Republican – Democrat – Libertarian – Socialist – Communist whats the problem with all these Parties. They all want to take the country in one direction. They want to force their particular philosophy on all of those of us that may not want to go in that direction. I can understand a candidate wanting to identify his political beliefs to attract voters in his district. For some reason I feel that on the national level the politics of Party is not good for the country. Our National Parties are there for no other reason than to perpetuate themselves. They do this through raising money on the national level and funneling it to the local level. This drives the cost of running a campaign to the level that a candidate cannot run for office without the Parties support. This eliminates a lot of good people from attempting to run. I propose that the only money that can be used by a candidate has to be raised in the district that he is running. While writing this I am thinking of a report, from earlier this year, that Chris Dodd had no contributors from the state he represents. Level the playing field. Then maybe we will get some candidates that truely reflect the beliefs of the electorate. Not some party hack or RINO or DINO.
Think outside the box. Be unconventional. During the revolutionary war, didn't the British complain about our forefathers not fighting conventionally? They were "unconventional"…….it was said that they fought using tactics like that of the Native American Indians.
If "picking a fight" with the GOP and "calling for an inquisition against RINO's is sowing seeds of defeat.." – well, this would be a reflection on GOP!
Either they see what WE the people want, or they are in the way and part of the problem.
I am tired of ' what if '. It's time to go for broke and keep pushing. There are many things to be accomplished here……and one will be to see what the Republicans are really made of. (Pls. forgive the spelling.)
Here's an interesting question. Even with a RINO in the race, what if Hoffman wins? What sort of reverberations will that have. This is only one local election. I'd rather send my money and vote to a conservative candidate, on the chance that they will win and scare the pants off of the GOP establishment.
Even better, it will embolden conservatives to take control of the party. Especially based on today's Gallup poll putting Conservatives as a bigger group than independents and twice as big as liberals.
The winning formula is for conservatives to take back the party and run conservatives. Period.
Otherwise, we're just a slower version of the same descent the Democrats are taking is down.
It is time for another conservative revolution. Taking our ideas to the people instead of just pointing out that the dems are too radical.
It is time to be the radicals.
I'm tired of having to hold my nose to vote for a Republican just because he or she is supposedly not a Democrat! The GOP needs to wake up and realize that they've lost their base. I refuse to vote for another Republican who is really a liberal in disguise. Like somebody above said, the Repubs are walking us off a cliff instead of driving us over. The result is the same; we're still going off that cliff.
Amen, the dems bend their opinion with the movement of the current, they try to be all things to all people (that is how Barry O was elected). What happened to standing on principle? I for one, will not vote for some wishy-washy moron just because he has an R after his name. If the Republicans do not want to stand for something, they will be swept aside in the coming tide of conservativism. If Independent is all I can get, so be it.
[...] Michelle Malkin, because I think you’re brilliant and an amazing investigative reporter, but this guy makes sense to me. However, those who fall in line with Hoffman and Palin, keep on with the protestations because it [...]
Mr. Tuohey needs to read this account of what the RINO's did to GW Bush's presidency – http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2009/10/024... This is what happens when principles do not come first. My vote is to send all RINO's packing from the Republican Party. Let them join the Democrats so they can be who and what they really are – liberals.
Mr. Tuohey needs to read this account of what the RINO's did to GW Bush's presidency – http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2009/10/024... This is what happens when principles do not come first. My vote is to send all RINO's packing from the Republican Party. Let them join the Democrats so they can be who and what they really are – liberals.
For me, NY 23's an extreme RINO example where I'd draw the line – Scozzafava is so liberal that her positions would be difficult to sell in a Blue Dog Democrat district, much less what appears to be a solidly Republican district. However, my RINO-hunting license does not extend so far as comments like this
"3.) If voting against RINOs results in the country moving left faster, then so be it. The faster we break the country, the faster we can get to the point of agreeing on the founding principles of this great nation. "
Are we really so hobbled by the Maine Sisters, Graham, McCain et al that we need to resort to Robespierrean rhetoric like this ? If the country "breaks" how are we going to get to a "point of agreeing" ? Who's going to schedule the new Constitutional Convention ? And do we want to be the people who are setting out to "break" it ?
The "agreeing on the founding principles" needs to begin in the GOP, not in some mythical "broken" America in which the South and the Great Plains have seceded from The People's Republic of Washington.
The problem with most people I encounter who take the "No More RINOs – my way or the highway" approach is that their idea of a RINO may not jibe with the rest of us.
Is Rudy a RINO because he supports Roe v. Wade ? Huckabee supporters say "YES !" Is Huckabee a RINO because he commuted the sentences of "redeemed" criminals ? Rudy supporters say "YES!" Are both of them RINO's ? Thompson supporters say "YES!"
In short, a RINO is a nominal Republican who disagrees with me. The truth to RINOism is found in degrees of deviation from a recognized standard, not in some starkly clear line in the sand. And we have yet to agree on that standard.
The moderate side of the party needs to recognize that there are core principles which the GOP stands for which will alienate some voters just as they will appeal to others. And the conservative side needs to learn how to sit at the table and negotiate instead of issuing proclamations and ultimatums.
A political party rests on principles, ideology, philosophy and policies – it's not a box of cereal you can market to any consumer. But a party without members doesn't get much done. Political success comes from finding a viable equilibrium between those alternatives.
If we have two socialists parties, do we pick the one whose name starts with "R"? Is that how it works?
The Republicans still don't get it. Since 2003 I've been voicing my disapproval of their governance, first by writing letters to my congresscritters, then by withholding contributions, then ultimately by leaving the party in 2005. I even wrote them a letter telling them why I did all of these things (spending, growth of government, social-wedge-issue pandering).
Each time I wrote the RNC, they replied with a request for more money. They didn't even acknowledge anything I had written.
We're fed up with the deficits. We're fed up with your total willful ignorance of constitutional principles and limited government. We're fed up with the OMG!!!_ABORTION!11!!_POT!!_GAY!!11!!! pandering.
You either believe in fiscal responsibiilty or you don't. You either believe in limited government or you don't. You either believe in "getting government off the backs of the common people", or you don't.
Pull your heads out, GOP.
Latest poll for NY District 23 shows the independent Conservative Hoffman with a slight lead over the Democrat with the ACORN RINO, Scozzafava in third. If this holds American politics, specially amongst Republican elites will be hit like the world was in 1917 from Russia.
The poll, by Club for Growth has a small sampling of 300 for a reliability of plus minus 5.6. However in three polls recently Hoffman has taken second place in two and first in this one. Obviously the Republican should withdraw from the race if she wants to put a dent into Pelosi's scorched earth policies.
If Doug Hoffman wins, not only will it energize conservatives it will demoralize RINOs.
So go, Dougie!
Conservatives are well aware of how splitting vote on the right gets you a democrat every time. We saw it with Perot giving America Clinton twice, and setting up the Democratic Party as it is today. Conservative principles were severely watered down by Newt et al in a mistaken belief the Republican Party had to expand its tent into Progressivism to attract more votes, leading "Compassionate Conservatism". In turn "leaders" like McCain modified issues like tax cuts, McCain Feingold, and Immigration Reform in order to appeal to similar calls. Even Reagan suffered from this.
A little What If?
What If Perot never appeared leading to a Bush I re-election. Bill Clinton becomes a nobody much like Edwards. Democrats run a new candidate against Powell in 1996 leading to the first Black President being a Republican. No GW Bush, instead his brother, Jeb, wins the nomination in 2004 and is now in his second term. The Supreme Court now leans 6-3 right and is deciding constitutionality of the EPA at this moment. There is no McCain Feingold, Illegal Immigrants are routinely being sent back home, but rules for immigration have been relaxed somewhat due to demographic needs of the nation.
The economy went through a recession due to Dot Com/ 9-11 as before, but the housing bubble has not yet developed to a point to crash it today. Instead Fannie and Freddie are curbed in time. Democrats do take the House and power shifts a sea-saw in the Senate over the period. Tax reform has gone ahead along with Tort reform. At this time US GDP is about 15 Trillion per annum instead of 13.5 T, "real" unemployment is 6.5%, not 16% as is is now.
These estimates are based on several major mistakes Congress made between 1992 and today being somewhat muted by a series of Republican Presidents. Right wing voters would have supported Powell according to polls at the time, he would have been more center right than Bush. Al Qaeda would still have hit NY on 9-11 due to attitudes leading up to the attack. Powell would not have invaded Iraq choosing to capitalize on global angst to concentrate on Afghanistan. Jeb Bush would have served one term as Governor of Florida well positioned to seek office in 2004.
Splitting the vote can have terrible fallout. A conservative revolution started by Reagan was crimped by maneuvering afterwards. Bush I was not the best person to follow on in hindsight. However Perot did more damage to America than most are aware of.
Considering the GOP wants to end the era of Reagan, it may not be a bad thing if the GOP goes the way of the Whigs.
What good comes from constantly supporting the GOP candidate no matter what and then have them lie down and compromise with people who want the destruction of the country? How is any true compromise possible with a political party that sees the United States and the major evil in the world today?
If the GOP can't stand up effectively to that then maybe the GOP's time has passed. If the era of Reagan is over then what do we even need the GOP for anymore?
Thanks, my friends…
"Once more, unto the breach, dear friends, once more…"
I voted for McCain, I voted for Specter
I say SO???? to this article.
Amazing how those words still can ring true…
If what is coming out of NY-23 as of late is true, you just might get your wish…
[...] See more here: Big Government » Blog Archive » Tea Party Dilemma: Honey, I Shrunk … [...]
Why is it idfficult to understand that a huge amount of us who support and advocate for decreased involvement of government in our lives and our wallets are not Republicans?
I could care less if a Republican loses if the Republican shares none of my values or principles. I want all socialists to lose. With only 20% of American self-identifying as Republicans, good luck trying to win any election without the support of the huge chunk of the remaining 80%.
The argument to remain in the Republican party so we can steer it misses the point. I don't want to be affiliated with a party willing to sacrifice principles for political expediency. Instead of expecting us to hold our noses and vote for liberal RINOs, the strategy we are now embracing will force RINO Republicans to hold their noses and put up conservatives. They will do this or they will perish. Without conservatives we're heading down the sewer anyway, so might as well make a principled stand for once and see where that takes us. It worked with Reagan, and it will work again. We change the party by ignoring it until it proves itself.
Since I, and many conservatives/libertarians who have commented seem to disagree with this article, it looks like the GOP had better get their act together and stop pushing wishy-washy, mealy-mouthed RINOs onto us; otherwise, this will be a defunct political party. We want candidates who can articulate conservative principles and speak out against this drastic shift to the Left in our government! This crap about a third party giving the vote to a Democrat is the same theory I spewed for a long time, but the truth is we are being told by those in Washington that we're going to get socialist policies whether we like it or not. Our choices are Democrats who will take us there in lightning speek, or Republicans who will take us there slow but steady; we don't like either choice! We want conservative representation and if we can't get it from the GOP, we'll get it elsewhere! BTW, the latest polls show Hoffman in the lead!
Can the GOP turn out thousands for local rallies week after week like the Tea Parties are doing? Can they rally a million people to Washington, DC like 912? If the GOP leadership had half a clue, they would be coming to US (conservatives) and I'm sure not seeing it so far.
If the party splits, will it be our fault for clinging to conservatism? Or theirs for clinging to moderate-RINO-crap? Cuts both ways, ladies and gentlemen. And the RINO-types have no more claim to the GOP than the conservatives do.
So fight hard NOW, conservatives. Take back the GOP & let the Scozzafava-types run 3rd party, if they must.
If standing up for conservatism splits the GOP; let it split! Yes, I will die on this hill. The 'moderates' will be just as culpable for destroying the GOP by continuously spitting in the face of conservatism and expecting us to take it, and just keep supporting them.
If the GOP doesn't get on board with conservatism, it probably will indeed be its death. It may take a few years, but we'll see who rises from the ashes: 'mods' or conservatives. I'm willing to take my chances.
want it in the form of a Python reference?
Remember the Spam, spam, eggs and spam schtick? Well, with these RINOs, being served up are crap-sandwiches with "just a little crap in them" and for that we are supposed to be grateful?
check please.
I don't know what it is like in your district, but in many, you don't get to vote in the primary if you are not registered with a party
And I think the primaries are where we need to really fight hard.
YOU for president! (& thanks)
Yes, if we keep backing third party candidates, we'll fail. On the other hand, we need to get better Republican candidates despite the way that the party leadership has been picking them for us, leaving us with lousy options. That means getting engaged – at the precinct, county, and state leadership level in the party – and getting better organized to support conservative candidates in primary races as well as general elections.
What are you prepared to do? http://www.TeaMoney.ning.com
There are two other problems with the bargaining problem. The ceiling of human behavior is not that high. Men are not angels. But the basement floor is very far down, indeed. When you are constantly compromising, you are constantly edging further and further toward the bottom of the pit. You do it this time and say, "oh, that was fine. See? The world didn't end." And then you do it again, and again, and again, because there is no line in the sand when compromise is itself the objective. Each time you compromise, you therefore encourage the next compromise. We've been compromising ourselves for 30 years. Why not another 4 or 8 or 100? That's why we find ourselves looking at the Republicans and asking ourselves how we got here. It is how you find yourself, years after you'd been wrongly accused by an illegitimate authority, with your neck on the chopping block. Simple. Every small step down the stairs for the sake of finding that middle ground.
No. No pasaran. You shall not pass.
I have my own version of cap and trade. We cap their powers and trade all of these socialist out in the next election.
I have my own version of cap and trade. We cap our representatives powers and trade all of these socialist out in the next election.