Tales of a Failed State: More Problems with California’s ‘Amazon Tax’
by Capitol ConfidentialAs we have previously reported, it looks like the proposed “Amazon tax” scheme being pursued by California liberals is going to do severe damage to the state’s already hurting economy and affect a broad swath of internet-based businesses known as “affiliates.”
But from the Sacramento Bee, we learn that California-based eBay– a big name in the state– has also grown deeply concerned about the effects of the proposed legislation:
California lawmakers thought they were targeting Amazon.com, the out-of-state giant, when they voted last week to force Internet retailers to collect sales tax.It turns out eBay Inc., California’s own golden child of e-commerce, isn’t so thrilled about it, either.The San Jose online auction company says the legislation would hurt its business model, which relies on thousands of entrepreneurs who sell goods on its site.The intent may have been to go after Amazon, but “we’re literally caught in the crossfire,” said David London, senior director for state government relations at eBay.
This news story comes only one day after Cal Watchdog reported that this tax could kill off 25,000 California businesses, costing the state jobs:
Performance Marketing Association Executive Director Rebecca Madigan said her association opposes [Assemblywoman Nancy] Skinner’s bill. PMA represents 25,000 California small-business affiliates who earn revenue by placing advertisements for online retailers on their Web sites.Madigan said they will be forced to move or terminate their businesses if AB153 is signed into law. “That’s 25,000 small businesses that will be lost to California’s already struggling economy,” said Madigan.
Currently, the ‘Amazon tax,’ repackaged as AB 27 X1, is in legislative limbo. The tax was part of the budget deal that was recently vetoed by Governor Jerry Brown. Now legislative analysts are trying to figure out if the ‘Amazon tax’ can go directly to the governor, who has signaled his support for the tax, or if the bill has to go through the legislature again.
It is important to note that thanks to Proposition 26, “Amazon Tax” legislation is almost certainly required to garner the support of 2/3 of both the Assembly and the Senate in order to pass. When the tax was passed earlier this year, it fell short of this mark. It does not appear that enough Republicans are going to change their mind anytime soon to meet the supermajority requirement.
So no matter if this tax goes directly to the governor or back through the legislature and then to the governor’s desk, the ”Amazon Tax” will be challenged in court, and the tax appears likely to be eventually deemed unconstitutional (“Amazon Taxes,” say experts, fall afoul of the Supreme Court’s ruling in Quill v North Dakota).
In the meantime, companies like Amazon and Overstock.com will cut any and all remaining ties to the state, small businesses who benefit from participating in affiliate programs with online retailers will be severely hurt, eBay may take a big hit, and the state will continue to hemorrhage jobs.
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77 Comments
Seriously, is EVERYBODY in Kalifornia high? Every teenager eventually figures out when their parents are tired of picking up the tab for them. Kalifornia better figure this out fast, small businesses are fleeing the state in droves, more every year. There won't be any employees left to pay taxes soon!
Someone grab the plunger,hurry,it's starting to overflow!
But hey,they can make money growing and selling pot!
This is what happens when a criminal entity (Democrat Party) runs a state for decades.
I guess Ebay will be moving soon !
Singapore or Hong Kong !
Message to CA commies: Your state is NOT "Hotel California"–businesses have been checking out AND leaving!
Infinite liberal wisdom…put up a tax wall and expect people to keep walking into it.
Ebay is welcome in Indiana; we like businesses. Just ask Illinois! We're happy to have all those Internet based businesses move here. We'll probably give them tax abatement's for their offices too.
They would do better to tax idiocy.
No, we're not all high. A goodly portion of us are FURIOUS.
Attention Small Business OWNERS, Arizona is quite nice and we have a lot of folks looking for decent jobs that you have to offer. Wages are less expensive as is the cost of living. Come on over to the RIGHT SIDE!
But the harm to innocent people (namely the ones who voted against Jerry "The Eternal Hippie" Brown) will be hurt.
They don't call them "Tax & Spend Liberals" for nothing! Their Socialism will be the ruination of America if we don't stop these Dem Socialist parasites! .They only respond to hard ball politics. So choke off their funds and their endless Govt Grants! Let them drown in their own debt.
It is time to move out of this state. Is there a rehab unit for Democrats that can remove their need for spending other people's money?
More important is to remove the libtards from the control room. But the illegal immigrant is part of it, and of course some of them are voting, with the assistance of the libtards.
(By the way the possessive of it is its. It's = it is.)
Ebay and Amazon are two poster children for the lefties failed tax tax and more tax solution.
Everyone watch as California demonstrates to the rest of the nation what is looks like to be lead to economic death by progressive filth.
Tax idiocy at 50% of income, and Hollywood would pay billions.
I, for one, hope that it becomes a reality because I want all the progressive states (like CA, IL, NY, MI, etc.) to get so bad for business environment that companies move out to right-to-work states.
This is war, ladies and gents, and the only way to defeat progressivism is for it to fail miserably (as we know it will) as quickly as it can. Then maybe the American sheeple will finally wake up to the nightmare that is progressive liberalism. http://defendourconstitution.blogspot.com/
Amazon is a "progressive" type outfit, being targeted by "progressives" in the CA legislature.
Typicially, they don't like their ox getting gored. Everyone else, OK with them..
Some well placed words on Golden Goose Capitalism, from Jeff Bezos may put things in proper perspective for the communists in CA.
Ann
Then again, maybe not. The Golden State is Greece, only they don't see it yet. Legislators had better get out your Rosetta Stone to translate the obvious handwriting, well, everywhere.
We haven't got much choice. After the 90 census, the Dems and the wimp assed Repubs carved the state up into nice safe districts, So Pelosi gets the loony bin across the Bay, Diann Watson gets South L A, Filner gets the white dumb ass union and Latinos in South San Diego, etc. etc. Over 20 years of that and you see the results today, a State House full of gray haired hippies, and a state budget going through the roof, and business that can stampeding for the door.
There are damn few bright spots except for San Diego where at least we still have enough military and business minded to stay marginally sane.
All you disaffected Kalifornia businesses are welcome to come to the Midwest. We've recently emerged from our blue sickness (well, except for Illinois), and we're ready to host your new headquarters.
And if you don't like the weather, wait a few minutes, it'll change
I see politicians are really creative at "finding" new sources of revenue, consequences be damned. If the dreadful situation in CA does not illustrate for even the brain dead that CA and the USA gov't has a spending problem and only a spending problem. WTF! Folks keep the powder dry and the guns clean and ready. It is almost time. August 2nd 2011?
Bottom line, as is the case with all these new tax plans various states are toying with to raise revenue, is that in the end they will end up losing revenue as well as losing businesses. It's been shown time and time again that the more they raise taxes, the less they receive and the more they target business, more businesses go under or move away. They just never seem to learn…
It is called the Law of Unintended Consequences and Libtards never take it into consideration. Pass a law, any law, and when the consequences start occurring, we will legislate them also.
Unfortunately, in San Diego the dominant newspaper has become just another propaganda arm of the DemonRat party. While this initiated a rapid decline in subscriptions, the suppression of facts and promotion of feel good Peoples' magazine type reporting prevents the politically naive from ever becoming informed. While they have dismissed much of the staff, new, cheaper hires are requierd to be uninformed progressives. For 20 years San Diego has been slipping to the left and there does not seem to be much to stop the slippage.
Here is a simple question for Corporate America. Why in the world would you set up shop in Kalifornia, Illinois, TAXachusetts, or New York? They all have one thing in common. THE INMATES ARE RUNNING THE ASYLUM! Move to a tax and business friendly state, and if that doesn't work, no one would blame you for moving your operations overseas. The TAX AND SPEND LOONS never have, and never will get it!
Thanks for the microscopic correction. I will get right on it.
Then show the rest of us you folks in California are ready to stand up and stop government.
But where? Monkey see monkey do. Other states like NY plan the same thing even though Congress has repeatedly passed laws against this conduct. What is sad is it doesn't hurt Amazon as it is passed through to literally millions of small business entrepreneurs making a living on the internet. Amazon's solution: Stop the affiliate program because of the hassle from state governments. Amazon shut down its Texas distribution site and moved it to more friendly AZ.
I live in California. Do I agree with what is happening in my state? HECK NO….but the conservatives here are out numbered by the liberals. For whatever reason, the populace has yet to learn the simple fact that when you vote in liberals, you get liberal policies. Liberal polices eventually lead to ruin socially and economically. Please don't reply back telling me to "just move." That is much easier said than done. Believe as much as I have strong ties to this state, I would like to move someplace where sanity prevails because I don't see sanity prevailing here any time soon.
Watch out!. The Feds might file suit against you for moving to a more business friendly state. Just look at Boeing.
Ah the law of unintended consequences rears it's ugly head AGAIN! Kalifornia, land of fruits, nuts and idiot leftist legislatures. Last one out of Kalifornia, extinguish the candle! (No electricity because it's bad for the environment!)
Couldn't happen to a more marxist state!
Gentle Readers,
READY……..
FIRE!!!!!
( Did we forget something? Oh, ….. yeah…… )
AIM……
Oh,……well…..
- John C Lepant Brighton CLO
I just love a TROLL free morning….them babies will be getting up here in a few hours to post some Koch brothers blah blah..but for now it's nice.
There is a rather annoying feedback loop in that conservatives do leave, thus increasing the relative proportion of leftists, and thus allowing the ridiculous policies to continue even as some become convinced how stupid the policies are.
And no candle because of the carbon and smog emissions from the smoke.
This was one of the most ridiculous taxes I had ever heard that was actually intended to increase revenue. When will the far left learn that peoples behavior towards something changes when you tax the crap out of it.
Taxation is Theft
http://godfatherpolitics.com/118/taxation-is-thef...
"It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it." George Washington
In essence, California is saying "Our citizens are spending money and WE HAVE A RIGHT TO A CUT!"
They smell money, but how to get at it? It's a puzzler. Seems the citizens (or "cash cows", as the legislature likes to think of them) decline to volunteer their money to the state for an internet transaction that has NO CONNECTION WHATEVER to the state, other than being originated there. Mind you, the state tried – the CA Turbo-tax forms had a "did you buy anything on the internet for which you owe California sales tax?" question, which anyone capable of rational thought answered in the negative.
So now they're going to kill the goose to get the golden egg. Great plan.
In essence, California is saying "Our citizens are spending money and WE HAVE A RIGHT TO A CUT!"
They smell money, but how to get at it? It's a puzzler. Seems the citizens (or "cash cows", as the legislature likes to think of them) decline to volunteer their money to the state for an internet transaction that has NO CONNECTION WHATEVER to the state, other than being originated there. Mind you, the state tried – the CA Turbo-tax forms had a "did you buy anything on the internet for which you owe California sales tax?" question, which anyone capable of rational thought answered in the negative.
So now they're going to kill the goose to get the golden egg. Great plan.
Some of us are not commies, but you are right. We have lost quite a few companies here. Seems they actually like to make money. Now they are going after the Fresh & Easy chain. They are not union and use all self check out stations to keep prices low. There is a bill in Sacramento to make it illegal to sell alcohol at self check outs. Which they sell at fairly good prices.
The Dems are like parasites that cause the death of their host. Oblivious to the consequences of their actions; it doesn't matter, as long as their species survives.
In essence, California is saying "Our citizens are spending money and WE HAVE A RIGHT TO A CUT!"
They smell money, but how to get at it? It's a puzzler. Seems the citizens (or "cash cows", as the legislature likes to think of them) decline to volunteer their money to the state for an internet transaction that has NO CONNECTION WHATEVER to the state, other than being originated there. Mind you, the state tried – the CA Turbo-tax forms had a "did you buy anything on the internet for which you owe California sales tax?" question, which anyone capable of rational thought answered in the negative.
So now they're going to kill the goose to get the golden egg. Great plan.
Right behind you Snoop.
EBay, if you are reading this please note: COME TO TEXAS. We like businesses. We fully understand how taxes work. We would most likely offer a nice tax abatement (especially here in Williamson County) because we learned a GREAT lesson from Dell: We have seen 10% growth a year from Dell moving here. The taxes from all the new homes and businesses that have sprung up since Dell moved here have far outweighed the tiny tax abatement we gave them when they moved here.
Come on over, Ebay! We're ready to move you in and make you comfortable!
Yeah, I agree. The UT is just another rag thanks to Helen Copley. The only other source of information is local talk radio. Slater, Roberts, and Chip Franklin, and a surprisingly level headed La Donna Harvey. I remember her from her old KFMB days as the news babe.
That would seriously cut into Micheal Moore's McDonald's tab.
It isn't just the small businesses. 64 large corporations have left California since January (businesses that do a million or more a year); many of them moving here to Nevada. As far as small business go, I've noticed quite a few California based small businesses (including restaurants) open up a tiny place in Reno so they can claim their headquarters are in Nevada. They still have to pay CA sales taxes, but not the corporate taxes.
Is there a reason you spelled it with a K??
Anyway, you're right, I just received an email from a company I regularly do business with informing me that I will no longer have to pay sales tax on their items…..because they've moved out of California!
Those few of you who are not communists need to "go Galt" and move. Get out like you were fleeing a brush fire. Once there is no one in the asylum but the inmates, their problems will self correct. The wetbacks will leave when there are no more bennies. The libtards will go broke taxing each other, and starve. Once they've killed each other off, sane people can return to an empty state.
No. Democrat's need to spend other people's money is bred to the bone.
Sorry, but you bring to mind a homeowner in Pompei saying: "But Pompei is my home! I have ties here, I can't leave."
Hell yeah Sam, it's called conservative voter registration, easy to do and best part of all no DT's.
Some of us, not by choice, are wards of the Family Law Court and therefore are not permitted to leave without permission of the Court because of child custody issues.
The only place I'm sure my ex would move to would be Vegas because his parents live there, but employment is not doing well there, otherwise, I could be persuaded to do so. I would consider Texas because of how well it's doing or going back to Jersey only because I have family in the area, but he would consider neither.
Basically even while married he refused to move anywhere but a state in the Southwest.
So, you see, it's not that easy to just pick up and move for many of us. If we didn't have children, I would have packed my bags by now and moved.
I appreciate all those who have responded to my entry. LIke another noted, some of us have ties that preclude us from leaving CA. In my case, it is aging parents and in-laws who need help. Some may think the fifth commandment of "Honor thy mother and father" is outdated, but my hubby and I happen to think otherwise.
I agree with the comment about the "feedback loop." Most of our friends who have moved out of the state were conservatives who became fed up with CA. For example, our former neighbors moved to Idaho. They said roughly a third of their new neighborhood was made up of folks who left CA. Just as I don't see the insanity previously noted ending anytime soon, I fear the number of conservative folks leaving CA will only increase exacerbating the "feedback loop."
The trouble is when they leave, they infect other states with their liberal disease. Ex: WA, OR, CO all infected by Californians.
Sorry, didn't mean to imply everyone in CA is a commie. I was referring to the ones who think they own you and your money.
Apparently the California Legislature cannot conceive of the possibility that California Internet Shoppers would prefer to frequently pay MORE in shipping charges than the amount of the California Sales Tax…(8.75%)….because at least FED-Ex & UPS will not throw the money down an unending sewer like the MORONS in the California Legislature will do.
Can we please bankrupt this state ?
They really new to start over?
Illinois riaised taxes and now are loosing business to the neighboring states – oh and the governor is making deals to keep business in the state – net the state may net loser after all the deals and lost business
Liberals do not understand business – but they sure will a deal.
Ebay to Texas – they do not need to make deals
eBay has raised its fees to the point where many sellers have simply quit. The loss of those jobs won't show up in the jobless numbers. It would be interesting to know how much business eBay has lost by passing the high cost of doing business in California along to its members.
Unfortunately, leftnuts are like viruses. Those freaks just mutate. Dying off would take hundreds of years.
I agree, I may have no choice but to move elsewhere, but I'll be damned if I let these scum infest my beautiful California forever. Too bad these cowards are also hypocrites, and won't leave this country that they hate.
They could also drill and sell their resources.
Add Montana and parts of Idaho.
Just remember; when I move next door to you that I left california because I agree with you that it is out of control / run by idiots…
A couple weeks ago, I read that 6 businesses were leaving Mexicornia PER DAY. And it is only going to get worse. I hope both E-Bay and Amazon pack up and move out. Until they do, I have decided not to buy anything from their businesses!
Great! Do it you liberal twits! The faster you kill business in California, the quicker businesses move to the business friendly South and other Western states and creat jobs for people who deserve them. While you are at it, create a sanctuary state for illegals called Mexifornia! We will all sit back and watch Liberal-Marxist run states crash in flames. Good riddance!
The situation is about the same in Illinois. Our "earnest" Democrat governor, Pat Quinn, ("Earnestness is stupidity gone to college" – P.J. O'Rourke) signed into law a 66% increase of the state income tax rate earlier this year (along with an increase of the state corporate tax rate). Not long after that, he also signed into law a sales tax on Internet purchases. Recent news reports state that – surprise, surprise – the State of Illinois will still experience a budget shortfall of around $11 billion dollars. I've seen billboards on the Illinois Tri-State Tollway encouraging Illinois businesses to flee to Indiana. I know a number of friends that have moved to Indiana to get away from the high property taxes and crummy public schools.
Forget it, sell out while the getting is good, buy yourself some land in the South and live the tax free good life in a no income tax state. Your beloved California is headed for the Marxist trash heap of history!
Like the CTA (Chicago Transit Authority): keep raising fares and cutting service, then act baffled when ridership precipititiously drops.
I wish to dispel the rumor that Michael Moore frequents McDonald's – he's a Wendy's man.
Amazon and ebay: Move out of California. Bring your jobs somewhere else.
In California,
We had the aerospace industry, car mfg plants, steel plants, agriculture, medical device, computer & chip fab, pharmaceutical industry, oil and nat gas, mining. After Gov. Brown's first reign, one by one all the companies left. Now, with an illegal alien, and Union Troll elected state legislature, it doesn't even make sense to open a taco stand.
Nice Job Marxist Democrats.
Dell was originally located down in Austin, in Travis County. Travis started jacking up the taxes and trying all sorts of Communist "Green" regulations on them, you know, just like California would do them if Dell was located there. In fact, up here in Williamson County, we call Austin "the San Francisco of the South" because of their Communist outlook on Government.
Anyway, Dell said "Adios, mofos" and headed north. And then proceded to build itself into one of the largest computer companies in the world, partly because of a business-friendly tax environment in Williamson County. Travis Ccounty lost out on millions, perhaps billions in tax revenue because of their "stick it to the MAN" tax decisions.
I am so tired of the lack of information and lack of insight from people who comment here. Honestly: states like CA, NY, MA, pay for your low taxing states to have the services and infrastructure you live on. 32 states* receive more government money than they pay in taxes. If you live in one of these states you should start paying your fair share or stop complaining. You are the true freeloaders.
* = (New Mexico, Mississippi, Alaska, Louisiana, West Virginia, N Dakota, Alabama, S Dakota, Kentucky, Virginia, Montana, Hawaii, Maine, Arkansas, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Missouri, Maryland, Tennessee, Idaho, Arizona, Kansas, Wyoming, Iowa, Nebraska, Vermont, N Carolina, Pennsylvania, Utah, Indiana Ohio, Georgia.)
Here's the problem.
1) People aren't paying the sales and use tax that they are supposed to when they buy on-line. The law says that you should as the onus of collecting and paying taxes falls to the consumer and not the business when you pay on-line. If people paid this tax like you do in any store there would be no issues at all. The problem is that 99.99% of people dodge this tax.
2) Amazon is crying like a BIIIIIIIITCH attempting to make us feel bad for their affiliates that will "go out of business" when Amazon leaves the state. Amazon isn't talking about the thousands of items that THEY and not affiliates sell. Amazon is concerned about losing their competitive edge and that's all.
3) The legislation that mandates having a "physical presence" in the state that you do business with is outdated and antiquated. It was put in place to spur on-line sales when they were virtually nil. Just as the Constitution has been amended, as does this law.
Everyone that complains about the Amazon tax does so for selfish reasons (ex: "I have to pay more for my handbag…book…TV"). None of these people talk about the damage that Amazon and like sites do and have done to brick-and-mortar businesses. Try asking former employees of companies that have gone out of business in large part to Amazon's unfair tax advantage their thoughts about Amazon.
Support free and fair trade. Your job could be next!
Everyone watch as California demonstrates to the rest of the nation what is looks like to be lead to economic death by progressive filth .http://www.watchesn.com
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