Penn State’s ‘ClimateGate’ Inquiry Determines Further Investigation Is Needed
by Bob McCartyIn looking at four “possible allegations” of research misconduct against meteorology professor Michael Mann, a Penn State University panel has determined that further investigation is warranted for one of them.
The allegations — or “possible allegations” as they put it — stem from Mann’s alleged involvement in the “ClimateGate” e-mails scandal that surfaced in early December and seemed to show evidence of fraud and conspiracy among the research scientists and others whose work formed much of the basis of calls for extreme climate change regulation.
At the center of the scandal was Mann, the inventor of the famous “hockey stick” graph which claimed to show that, after 1,000 years of decline, global temperatures had shot up to their highest level in recorded history. It was made famous in Al Gore’s Academy Award®-winning documentary on global warming, “An Inconvenient Truth.”
While this is good news, I suspect panel members are secretly hoping someone else will shoulder responsibility for determining Mann’s guilt or innocence before they’re forced to reach any conclusion(s).
Below is the text of the release about the inquiry issued by members of the panel a short while ago:
University Park, Pa. — An internal inquiry by Penn State into the research and scholarly activities of a well-known climate scientist will move into the investigatory stage, which is the next step in the University’s process for reviewing research conduct.
A University committee has concluded its inquiry into allegations of research impropriety that were leveled in November against Professor Michael Mann, after information contained in a collection of stolen e-mails was revealed. More than a thousand e-mails are reported to have been “hacked” from computer servers at the Climatic Research Unit of the University of East Anglia in England, one of the main repositories of information about climate change.
During the inquiry, all relevant e-mails pertaining to Mann or his work were reviewed, as well as related journal articles, reports and additional information. The committee followed a well-established University policy during the inquiry (http://guru.psu.edu/policies/ra10.html ).
In looking at four possible allegations of research misconduct, the committee determined that further investigation is warranted for one of those allegations. The recommended investigation will focus on determining if Mann “engaged in, directly or indirectly, any actions that seriously deviated from accepted practices within the academic community for proposing, conducting or reporting research or other scholarly activities.” A full report (http://www.research.psu.edu/orp) concerning the allegations and the findings of the inquiry committee has been submitted.
In the investigatory phase, as in the inquiry phase, the committee will not address the science of global climate change, a matter more appropriately left to the profession. The committee is charged with looking at the ethical behavior of the scientist and determining whether he violated professional standards in the course of his work.
The investigatory committee will consist of five tenured full professor faculty members who will assess the evidence in the case and make a determination on Mann’s conduct.
Worth noting is the time frame set forth by university policy:
If an investigation is undertaken pursuant to this policy, the investigation should normally be concluded, and a decision made by the Vice President for Research and Dean of the Graduate School, within 120 days from the initiation of the investigation.
Stay tuned!
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101 Comments
When outright fraud is used to influence legislation those responsible for the fraud should face criminal charges.
Well, the global warming crowd hasn't given up yet. Just today I happened to turn on National Geographic Channel (hoping for the Dog Whisperer) and found myself watching "6 degrees". It told me that global warming due to CO2 is going to cause the Himalayan glaciers to melt in 35 years, the rainforests to burn down in South America, and that hurricanes will be an almost daily occurrence. I guess facts don't matter to them. I just hope they do to Penn State.
they still can't help but illuminate the 'fact' that the e-mails were 'stolen'…
As if that makes the offense worse than the results. What is known is that the university computers had multiple access; any legal beagle worth their salt will tell you that means you can't 'steal' that which is readily available.
No matter.
What is important is this attempt to defraud the US out of hundreds of billions of dollars to advance worldwide socialism in the name of 'climate change' has been halted- for now.
They will keep at it. Remain vigilant…
I also must add, in regards to the suppression of debate, that the general population will be made more aware of how peer reviewed journals were manipulated, and those scientists with evidence contrary to man-made global warming mantra of most were black-listed and bemoaned throughout the scientific community. From where I'm sitting it seems that the general population is poorly informed and easily manipulated, despite their intelligence in many cases. I truly hope people will see the fascist attitude/ tactics that, amazingly, the far-left and global warmers have adopted.
I have to agree with you. But I think that's a dream for us! haha! We can hope, though… and fight for the truth.
How about we make that fraud Gore give back all the money he stole with his carbon credits scam. To think this slimeball almost made it to the Presidency. What is it with the Democrats putting total scum up as President or candidates? Carter, Clinton, Gore, Odumbo. Here we have the cream of the Leftist crop.
So the investigators from Penn State phrase the allegations as “possible allegations.” Someone really needs to ask them about this, I mean if they aren't even sure if they have allegations then how could you even begin an investigation? This shows a clear bias in favor of Michael Mann, these "alleged investigators" have already disqualified themselves.
i takes us back to the "blue dress", without the e-mails, we might not have found out the scope of the fraud perpetrated by these "professionals". we can argue about the stolen e-mails all we want, but the bigger picture is the fraud it uncovered. it also takes me back to something about watergate. when the alleged burgalers were in jail, some of the materials they had in their possesion were inspected by woodward, and bernstein, and that is where the leads in the case took them. when a person is in jail, i don't think it is right for their possesions to be viewed by hack reporters, but nobody ever complained about that. as a matter of fact, it never raised even a eyebrow.
Did the Polar Bears get this memo?
Penn State is a land grant college.
Funding by agriculture, automotive chemicals and other disciplines related to climate can now dry up. 10 million here 30 million there. Of course waiting for the first real investigation to begin. Donors will wait. No hurry.
Penn State Mann morphs into
Mann in the Penn State Pen
Will he be able to blog on Real Climate from the Pen?
Come on Penn St. Do the RIGHT THING! Save your academic reputation. Fire this liar Mann. AttorneyGeneral – seek criminal conspiracy charges.
Then federal judge – sentence Mann to
JAIL TIME! JAIL TIME! JAIL TIME!
As for Al Gore – I'll be happy when he is forced to file for bankruptsy protection – his "fiefdom" is built on lies.
Guess again bozo. Read what they "cleared him of" and what they REFUSED to follow. Being cleared of falsifying data is not the same as being charged with modifying the model to get a SPECIFIC result. Might as well have tried to convict him of racketeering. If the charges are the wrong ones to bring forward in the first place, how could you EVER get a conviction of anything at all? It's not possible. The same thing happened here. They diod not want to find anything and most certainly didn't. After all its their own "loss of face" too that's being investigated.
Biden – academic fraud.
Kennedy – academic fraud.
Gore – scientific fraud.
I see a pattern developing here – we better "research it".
Never happen as his loss is also theirs.
Someone should've written "DUH" over Alwhore's face in pic above.
Why are you here? If you like this blog so much, man up (or woman up) and register. Otherwise all you do is call people names like a street thug teenager. Oh wait, thats what Libs do..demonize others by calling them rascists…LOL. That is so old and not working any more.
Don't miss the bigger point: Our society actually believes that the government has the responsibility to tax us and use the proceeds to save the environment through regulations and laws. As long as we cede that power to the feds, there exists a likelihood that whatever any scientist produces will be undertaken for the sole purpose of extracting more of our tax dollars for research, policy councils, legislative panels, etc. And YES… outright lying, cheating, and stealing.
or on that fat bastard's forehead – I'll "do it" if someone else "holds back" his security goons!
Although they usually sit in the limo with the engine running, and the A/C – or heat on fullblast (seasonal) while he's "preaching" his "global warming" bull crap.
May he die a poor, broken old man, his delusion demasked, his lies shattered.
Is it me or does Al "GasBag" Gore look like he is ready to explode?
harpy – what a loser. MANN GOT CAUGHT! Plain and simple.
This "AGW" scam is OVER! No Senate vote – no hard legislation – no,political will to keep pushing it.
The U.N. fraud meister GOT CAUGHT using a magazine article and an unproven thesis as "EVIDENCE"! LOL!
Done – Over – KILLED – Even the DemonKKKrat "Grand Kleagle" Bobby Byrd WON'T VOTE FOR CAP & TRADE!
No sane DemonKKKrat up for election is falling for this garbage.
If Penn State has any dignity it will confirm what is clearly obvious – and fire this clown for academic fraud – wash their hands of him and try to proceed with some integrity. These "researchers" turned this "man-made climate change" into a psuedo religion and the facade is falling off. The truth will restore Penn State's reputation and while getting their butts kicked by Ohio State on a consistent basis makes P.S.U a big time football school, faking and hiding data is a KILLER BAD REP to have. Devastating.
They really need to seperate, in a fair and legal way, from this fraud. He's agenda was exposed and that does Penn State ENORMOUS harm. Academic integrity is everything. Without that they're screwed – they're East Anglia!
Geez, think of all that pent-up methane that will get released.
U.S. Sen. James Inhofe (R-Tulsa)
Inhofe sends letter supporting Penn State investigation into Mann's 'climate science'
By Matt Dempsey – February 3, 2010 4:20 PM
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By Matt Dempsey
Posted: February 3, 2010
WASHINGTON, DC – Sen. James Inhofe (R-Okla.), Ranking Member of the Committee on Environment and Public Works, responded to Penn State's announcement today concerning its investigation into possible research misconduct by Dr. Michael Mann.
Penn State's internal inquiry found further investigation is warranted to determine if Dr. Mann "engaged in, directly or indirectly, any actions that seriously deviated from accepted practices within the academic community for proposing, conducting or reporting research or other scholarly activities."
"I want to commend Penn State for recognizing the seriousness of the allegations leveled at Dr. Mann by launching an initial inquiry into whether he committed research misconduct," Senator Inhofe said. "As the University moves to the next phase of its investigation, I believe the Inspector General of the National Science Foundation should also commence an investigation to examine possible violations of federal laws and policies governing taxpayer-funded research.
"The stakes involved here are enormous. The scientific work in question is part of a larger enterprise behind federal climate change policies that will cost American consumers trillions of dollars. So when we learn, as we did last week, that the IPCC's Fourth Assessment Report included serious errors, raising questions about the integrity of its work, we need to reassure the American people that their tax dollars are supporting objective scientific research rather than political agendas."
Full Text of Letter Included Below:
February 3, 2010
Allison C. Lerner
Inspector General
National Science Foundation
Office of Inspector General
You are turning into a lame parody of Keith Untermann. Just sad.
Been a rough month, hasn't it, Harpy?
Al Gore is an idiot.
Arguing that the Climate Cru should be exonerated because emails were stolen is a bit like arguing that a TV expose of a crime should be considered false because the camera crew got a ticket for double parking.
When are we going to tar and feather that fat blouted walking corpse and send him somewhere like Siberia.
Don't count on it……………it will be nothing but a CYA a la the ACORN "investigation" and nothing good will come of it.
.
These guys are guilty of committing crimes against humanity — no one should ever stop until they are tried for their crimes.
Marxism never sleeps….
.
.
They are all John Edwards democrats — they require a DNA sample before telling the truth.
THEY LIE!
.
HaHa its that loser jharp crying again. You are a pathetic waste of flesh, except that we all get to laugh at your expense. Please keep it up.
Al Gore, whose father KNOWINGLY took "blood money" from the KGM agent, Armand Hammer, for most of his adult life, was filthy; so is Jr., who also took money from Hammer !
He has made a rather large fortune from selling the HOAX of "GLOBAL WARMING"/"CLIMATE CHANGE", as well as "winning" a shared Nobel prize, with some of the HOAXERS who have now been revealed as liars and frauds.
I would hope that Penn State Alumni and benefactors would take a close look at this sham "investigation" and then decide if that is the type of "higher education" they really want to support with their donations.
Kennedy – DEAD swimmer and academic fraud.
Tom Sawyer talked Penn State into whitewashing the fence?! Sweet!
In other words SHOW ME THE DATA!
Funny how these emails are referred to as stolen when I thought a whistleblower liberated them just like Ellsberg liberated the Pentagon papers. The guy or girl should get an award. Besides, what is a possible allegation? I believe the allegations aren't possible ones but rather ones definitely made.
These democrats will be spared a trip to the gallows in the coming revolution. Their decision was made solely out of self preservation………….
""Reps. Collin Peterson (D-Minn.) and Ike Skelton (D-Mo.) – who head the Agriculture and Armed Services committees, respectively – introduced a plan Tuesday that would prevent the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) from placing limits on heat-trapping emissions from power plants, factories and other sources.
"I have no confidence that the EPA can regulate greenhouse gases under the Clean Air Act without doing serious damage to our economy," Peterson said in a prepared statement. "Americans know we're way too dependent on foreign oil and fossil fuels in this country – and I've worked hard to develop practical solutions to that problem – but Congress should be making these types of decisions, not unelected bureaucrats at the EPA.""
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2010/02/house...
The EPA has no authority to implement such draconian laws just as the IRS does not have the authority to pass laws. The leftwing tyrants in DC must be purged.
Wow…listening to the brain trust here is a hoot. You morons couldn't think your way out of a wet paper bag.
Hey Satan…blow it out your ignorant, inbred ass Bucky. Jeesuz…it must really suck to be so incredibly clueless. You need to pull your head out of your ass and get a friggin' grip.
Wow! Is that original, can I use it?
Observe the future, be amazed at their razor sharp wit!
Owlgore really means it this time, he’s super serial!
Penn State Mann morphs into
Mann in the Penn State Pen
Will he be able to blog on Real Climate from the Pen?
Awesome turn of phrase! I spit my beer out when I read it! Thanks for the laugh and the mess! Bass Turd! LOL!!!
That's IDIOT!!! You need the caps and exclamation to convey it accurately. We all knew what you meant, I'm just a stickler for conveying things in their proper fashion. I'm sure the bright ones among us got it just fine…
I have a few house plants that "emit" oxygen. In turn I breath this in and "emit" carbon dioxide. Should I fear that my house plants will be confiscated or taxed for "contributing" to "Global Warming"? Will I be banished from this ultra-cool forum for admitting I have house plants? I swear I barely take care of them, it's not really my fault! Unless there is a tax credit in there somewhere, or if some chick now digs me 'cause of what I said. Ramble, ramble, ramble… All the world makes sense if you'll just sip the cool-aid.
As long as there is big money to doled out in grants the global warming hoax will continue. At least now some of the truth is slowly getting out.
Most likely, but I do still hope that some bit of truth will get out to the general public. The more they come to realize and understand what this is, the better. Even though it will be tough. And how about that ACORN investigation, huh? Was that a joke, or what!
The foreign papers have done an excellent job exposing the HOAX and all of the players. American papers, for the most part, as well as T.V. stink on ice and then some, as far as getting out ANY news of this scandal and it IS a scandal!
The so-called "ACORN investigation", by one on their side, was a sick joke!
I don't know if you're old enough to remember Tiny Tim, the singer, but way back in the late 1960s, maybe 1970, he re;leased an album with a song on it, from the 1920s, in which some of the lyrics are "……………….THE ICE CAPS ARE MELTING, ……………….". I don't know if the GLOBAL WARMING crap was all that "fashionable" back then, but it must have been talked about.
I do well remember when the "big deal" was another HOAX……………………"THE NEW ICE AGE/GLOBAL COOLING" ! Some of the same idiots ( aka ecoterrorists/greenies ) were spearheading that one. Then it all morphed into "GLOBAL WARMING", which morphed into "CLIMATE CHANGE".
Go GOOGLE TIMESONLINE UK……………..just read a great article about the IPCC chief, Rajendra Pachauri an how much trouble he's in!
I think you can find a link on Drudge, on the lower left hand sided of that site.
Alan F,
You are one dumb SOB.
Go sign up for an English composition class. We'll all be better off for it.
I agree that the panel will not want to determine the "Guilt" or "Innocence" of Mann, however, whatever comes of this, iIhope some bit of Truth comes along with it.
That's the second one to rush directly to "Ur a big dumb dumb head" mode. wow
[...] the posts get really interesting at blogs like Michelle Malkin’s and Big Government, where the commentators claim outright that this is an example of a leftist/socialist/statist plot, [...]
holy smokes it jharp went from 0 to RASCIST AND UR SOOO STOOPID in like, 1.7 seconds 0_0
This whole entire tale is sooo completely rich, ti's tasty, I can't get enough of it.
[...] this Post, A BigGovernment writer starts blatantly spinning in the second sentence (emphasis added): [...]
Penn State is on the verge of becoming a thrid rate school if they keep a fraud researcher on board. They are postponing in order to get another "climate" grant. I will never send my children to this school. Professor Mann has participated in international fraud and should be penalized.
[...] Notes: IPCC under scrutiny EUReferendum: And now for Amazongate Bob McCarthy, Big Government: Penn State’s ‘ClimateGate’ Inquiry Determines Further Investigation Is Needed James Delingpole, Telegraph: After Climategate, Pachaurigate and Glaciergate: Amazongate Global [...]
That picture!!! Is your world falling apart Al?
Hey Al. Where is your next book signing?
Hello, 1redcent! I wasn't old enough to remember the things you mentioned earlier, but I am somewhat familiar with the whole "Next Ice-Age" thing they were spouting in the 70's. It's amazing how we can go to, on the verge of an Ice Age, to "Global Warming", and now, as you stated, "Climate Change". It's such a joke. IF, and I mean IF there is any nearly insignificant rise or fall in the global temperature, it's one of two things: Wither the natural cycle of the planet, or the Eco-nuts messing with data. Much like how, after the fall of the Soviet Union, they just "Forgot" to include temperature data from Siberia, which, if not taken into account, would make it seem like the global temp had risen 0.0002 degrees thus causing the extinction of humanity.
I think these people are nuts, and I am familiar with the IPCC chiefs "Confessions", if that's what you want to call it. I saw it on the UK Times as well. It's like they keep getting caught with their hand inthe cookie jar and a mouth full of treats and say, "Who me?".
Hopefully it's only a matter of time until the general public gets all this and we can move on to much more serious and important things like terrorism and MASSIVE government corruption.
I cant remember where I read it, may have been Big Journalism, but they are still trying to push the Himalayan Glacier melt story even after the IPCC Chief, and those that already had brains, knew it to be false. Quite frankly, I love watching these people squirm! All we have to do now is make sure our man-child president and his playground buddies don't push through Cap and Trade… They may be wrong, and in many cases stupid, but unfortunately for the moment they have some power. But not for much longer if Obama and Congress pushes through their $3.8 Trillion Budget… How RIDICULOUS IS THAT!?
Good Times, 1redcent. Keep up the good fight, my friend!
PS – Funny how some people eat up anything they here… Like Hollywood activists and leftist politicians, just so they can take advantage of it for themselves through the very capitalist system they despise. Interesting isn't it? haha!
i like ur vague facts, lol when are the left gonna b truthful and quit uses race, when none of this has to do with race. unless ur talking bout the human race!!!!!
Fire all the professors directly or indirectly involved with the climategate scandal. They along with their spokeman al gore CANNOT be trusted and have NO BUSINESS teaching. What will they teach, how to falsify results and get lots of money for it?
Throw Penn State out of the Big Ten
[...] good news of the day: Domestic fallout from ClimateGate. A panel at Penn State has said that further investigation needs to be done on Michael Mann, author of the infamous “hockey stick” graph. I [...]
I must have missed a memo–why is Breitbart racist?
When you're rotting from the inside, the methane turns you into a corpulent corpse–don't stand too close, especially with an open flame.
Way to stick to the subject jharpo.
Breitbart is a scum? We like like him a whole hell of a lot more than we do you and your kind.
You don't care if the science is fraudulent, all you care about is stealing the money from Americans.
That would create more "fairness" wouldn't it and your envy would go away.
Listen up, go feed your ten cats and take shower for God's sake.
That Obama money is just around the corner fool.
Man you can see the anger and hatred in this fools face.
Al Gwhore aka "the pig", "fat albert", "stinky", "steaming pile of monkey sh@t.
Is that all you got? You call people names like a ten year old? Any chance you'll argue the merits of your case? Naw, I thought not. Listen! Hear that? Mommy's calling you to come upstairs for lunch and to leave the conversation to the adults.
lots of gnashing and clawing about here – if only you could expend your energies toward familiarizing yourselves with the actual science… what a concept!
Actually, it's probably more accurate to say that Michael Mann talked Penn State into fencing the whitewash…
How come Al Gore has more hair than he did when he was the VP. Maybe global warming is the cure for baldness?
How is it that you are always on the wrong side of EVERY issue?
You would think that the law of averages would at least have you on the right side at least every one out of 100.
It must really suck to be a tool all the time.
I think the bloggers demonstrated it the first week of climategate the emails were *collected*, most likely by the UEA in preparation for release under FOI. "Stolen" is too strong a word to use in describing their release. They should have been released before that. I call it 'Whistle Blowing', which legally protects the person that the population of Earth owes a tremendous debt.
As I have said many times in the past, thats it, attack the person and not the statement!! Really shows your ignorance and maturity levels. Why don't you try explaining what is wrong with his statement for a change instead of coming on here, making a couple posts, and then attacking anyone that shows you that your wrong?
Exactly so; "stolen" is a misleading term, used to smear and discredit those who have proved what a HOAX this all has been.
Just think about the generations of children ( some now adults ), who were brain washed, by false "facts" and the billions made by the HOAXERS! It's all been a disgusting assault on the peoples of the world.
BRAVO………………..great post, Tony and I can't add a thing to it !
All of us have to "educate" everyone we know, because the American MSM sure aren't going to report any of this.
The economy stinketh and won't get any better this year. If Obama tries to get that damned Cap & Tax Bill passed, THIS YEAR, we'll be in the midst of a DEPRESSION comparable to where we were in the depths of the Great Depression, with NO hope at all, for generations; if ever and all because of a damned HOAX ! OTOH, the Dem Congress critters are now very spooked and in an election year, they just might dig their collective heels in and refuse to even look aty it. Should that happen, Barry can forget about it, because the GOP is going to take both Houses come November.
Which science are you referring to, the data manipulated by James Hansen of NASA or the data [decline in temp] that was hidden by "researchers" at East Anglia University?
You wouldn't know actual science if it bit you on the dick.
I sent an email to National Geographic and told them that they need to stop airing programs which perpetuate this hoax. That it diminishes any credibility that they may have to the point that none of their shows will have any integrity. I will cancel my subscription to their channel if they continue to have programs on that they know spout lies.
Don't forget Kerry.
Wouldn't "possible allegations" be kind of a redundant statement. You either have allegations or not. There is no "possible". The only "possibilty" is whether or not the allegations are true (which of course, we all know the answer to that one).
How is the ability to identify the truth behind the FACT that the whole global warming/climate change thing is a HOAX being racist? Are you saying that only people of certain color are able to determine what the truth is? Wouldn't THAT be racist?
AKA ManBearPig
Al Gore and idiot in the same sentence is redundant is it not?
So can you give us some facts to back up your insult – or are you only able to insult without anything to back it up?
What is so ironic and funny is the same envirowackos that think we should cut down on CO2 (they very thing that trees and plants breathe) also claim to want to save the trees and plants!
India to 'pull out' of UN 'global warming' panel because it 'cannot rely' on UN..found this in drudge report
Amen! I can't wait for the new Republican (& admittedly Tea Party) Revolution! Although I have to add to one thing you said… If the Cap & Tax bill is passed, along with some other factors due to bad policy, we may see a depression comparable to the Great Depression, I think it will be a lot worse. Especially with Terrorism involved. Imagine this: Our economy slides into a depression similar to that of the Great Depression. Not only do people now-a-days have less fortitude and that "hardness" that will be needed, but also a huge difference in Faith. As a Catholic I believe that we reap what we sow, and the amount of anti-Christian and religious sentiment is rampant. Then, enter terrorism: Suicide bombers, Eco-terrorism, bio-terrorism… with what will we have to cope with this in the midst of a Depression? The infrastructure and emergency services will be Ka-ka. Not to mention, when you put it all together with the popular culture mentality these days, I'm afraid that Americans will turn violently against other Americans. Granted this is a worse case scenario, but we certainly have the leadership in place to accomplish this in a very short time. God willing, it won't come to any of that and we'll all make it in time for the Republican takeover. I know it sounds very doomsday-ish, but I think it's a sober look at what could happen if everything falls apart at just the wrong time.
In that respect I must agree. I think it was more likely a whistleblower rather than some Russian Hacker. Lord knows those "scientists" were frightened of the Freedom of Information Act both here and the version in the UK.
Please reread the bit of my last post, wherein I said that we can easily be nudged into a depression as bad as the HEIGHT of the GREAT DEPRESSION. We are already in a "depression". It is now worse than it was in '29 through early '31.
Sadly most people, today, only know about THE GREAT DEPRESSION and have no idea that this was but the last depression America went through. There had been quite a few earlier depressions, in our past history, the one in the early 1890s being almost as horrific as the one that began in '29. The great difference being, the earlier ones didn't last as long, because the government didn't meddle all that much in them.
Today, Obama meddles in EVERY THING; stupidly including, of all thing, college football playoffs.
You're correct about not many of today's adults being able to handle these kinds of times. In the past, recessions, panic, and depressions, just like death, were things that everyone dealt with and which most just buckled down and worked through. That's not really so, for a great many, today.
I'm older than you and remember quite a few recessions from my childhood/teens. Having parents and grandparents who lived through the GREAT DEPRESSION ( and no, not everyone was throwing themselves out of windows, selling apples, or completely destitute back then, which is how it sort of comes across in films, books, and school texts now ), I can handle any downturn and have done. Can my offspring do as well? Probably not; though better than most, I'd willing to bet.
Not just Catholics believe that what your sow, so shall you reap; that's taught throughout all of Christendom ( probably NOT in Rev Wright's church and those like it though ) and in Judaism too, I think.
With fewer of the "faithful", that will also add to the burden, for nonbelievers and skeptics.
Today, when even the poorest of the poor have color T.V.s and such, coping, even in today's depressionlite economy, you can tell that some just aren't coping. When things get worse, and they shall, it's going to get pretty ugly.
What worries me, is that what Obama and his inept idiot horde have done in only one year, will continue, unabated, until January of 2011, when so many horrible things will have been done, that the undoing will take an inordinately long time; if ever.
Congress ( specifically the House ) holds the purse strings, but only a president can call for tax cuts and Barry has through 2012 to go.
Terrorism is an unknown quality, in the scheme of things economic. What isn't unknokwn, is that Obama can't handle it and is such a slow learner, that he's never going to get up to speed on it.
Okay, now I'm quite depressed……………………………………………………….. ;-(
[...] [...]
College Football Playoffs… I can't believe it either! I also find the people jumping out of windows misnomer pretty tragic. My grandparents lived through the GReat Dpression, God Bless them, and I know it wasn't pretty, so I give anyone that went through it all the respect in the world. I agree with everything you said, and most definitely saw what you wrote about with the Height of the Great Depression.
But the main reason I am commenting back is to tell you not to be depressed! In my somewhat short life, I have gone through much hardship with medical problems, culminating with problems with my pancreas, so I am no stranger to pain and suffering, but that is of the point, I don't seek pity. In a way, I want to let you know that I can understand what you're saying. Without tooting my own horn, even losing my house, job, friends and "social life", along with any hopes of falling in love anytime soon, I STILL believe that I can get through and everything will be OK. That is what i wanted to say to you most. As a people of Faith, we understand that the good must come with the bad, but more so, that only Good can come of the Bad. So despite me losing my twenties and all the fun, and even education, that went with them, I am still 100% Positive that something better lies ahead. i put my head down and power on through the tough times. I live in constant pain, so that is something I do everyday. But again, I certainly do not look for pity or sorrow. Rather, i would hope celebration… Celebration of the Good in life and ALL the GREAT and WONDERFUL things that are yet to come.
So please, don't be depressed!
No matter how bad it gets, we'll always get through it, and rewards of goodness await us after the storm.
I like you, 1redcent. I think you are a darn good and decent person. You have had a heck of a life so far, and I'm sure that many great things await you in the future.
And just so you know, I read every word you wrote, and not only respect your words, but also learned from and agreed with them. Hopefully we'll have another back and forth like this again, as I enjoyed it very much!
Tony, that is an incredible post and I am humbled by your kind words.
You'll get no pity from me, just empathy and my prayers.
Stay strong………..you have friends here and I'm sure that in real life, you shall get back your social life and someone special. As to the last, you just have to be at the right place at the right time, which is what everyone has to have, to find the one who clicks with you and you with her/him.
Have you tried finding a group /specialist that deals with living with pain? If not, look into it. There are some mental exercises that can work; though not perfect, you will feel some relief.
I was a curious kid, so I asked my grandparents to tell me all about what life was like, for them, before I was born. My grandmother was great about showing my old photos and then weaving great stories from them.
My parent were kids/teens during the GREAT DEPRESSION. Neither of them told stories about it, but my father, like so many others of his age, was quite stern about shutting lights off, when one left a room and stuff like that, which I'm positive was a result of having grown up during that time, just as my grandfather having been a small kid when the Depression of 1893 hit ( also known as the PANIC OF 1893 ) and lasted through 1898.
Those of us who were kids during WW II, even those who were babies and toddlers, have a different view of things than most BOOMERS ( and we aren't BOOMERS, BTW ) do. We also lived through recessions as kids and teens and young adults; we can handle rough times, because we already have done so.
I get depressed whenever I talk about Obama having three more years to screw up everything. Well, one more year of a more or less free reign. Unless the GOP steals defeat from the jaws of victory, which I don't believe will happen, the upcoming election, in November, is going to be a BLOWOUT, with the GOP taking back the House and the Senate.
What worries me, is that they'll do a great job, Obama will take credit for it all, and get *GAG* re-elected. Oh damn………………..I just depressed myself again.
[...] Stupid, Hu’s Not and ClimateGate: Maybe Models Really Are Dumb Bob McCarthy, Big Government: Penn State’s ‘ClimateGate’ Inquiry Determines Further Investigation Is Needed James Delingpole, Telegraph: After Climategate, Pachaurigate and Glaciergate: Amazongate The [...]
[...] Trzupek, Big Journalism: Drilling Down Into Obama’s Energy Promises Bob McCarthy, Big Government: Penn State’s ‘ClimateGate’ Inquiry Determines Further Investigation Is Needed James Delingpole, Telegraph: After Climategate, Pachaurigate and Glaciergate: Amazongate Watts Up [...]
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As a Penn State Alum I am embarrassed.
http://global-warming-hoax-blog.blogspot.com
For most families, daycare expenses form a huge chunk of their monthly budget, and it has become extremely difficult for them to see a way through it.
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