Big Government, Big Unions
by Bret JacobsonThis week brought inauspicious news: more union members work for the government than work in the private sector, “despite there being 5 times more wage and salary workers in the private sector.”***
Because of globalization, safer workplaces, Social Security, the ability to save for one’s own retirement through 401k plans, and a better-educated, more mobile workforce, only 7.2 percent of workers in the private workforce have chosen to join a union.
Compare that to the world of government employment, where there is no employer to tell people why a union might not be best for them (we’re the employer, but we’re a little busy with our day jobs) and you get 37.4 percent of government workers paying dues. All told, that’s 7.9 million that we pay and 7.4 million paid by people who actually create wealth.
And wealth, while a dirty word to some, is an important concept. Because private-sector unions can redistribute wealth from one private party (the company’s owners) to another (the company’s employees), one may not like a union’s political agenda but it’s tough to get too riled up about the direct role of a union (unless employees didn’t want it there in the first place).
But wealth as it relates to public-sector unions is different. We are the ones who pick up the tab, but it’s elected politicians — many of whom are helped into office by unions in the first place — that do the negotiating on wages, benefits, number of hours, etc. So public-sector unions continually drive up the cost of government by getting people elected to run the government.
Or, as one professor told the New York Times:
“At the same time the country is being squeezed, public-sector unions are a rising political force in the Democratic Party … They depend on extra money for the public sector, and that puts the Democrats in a difficult position. In four big states — New York, New Jersey, Illinois and California — the public-sector unions have largely been untouched by the economic downturn. In those states, you have an impeding clash between the public-sector unions and the public at large.”
See some recent examples from Oregon, Maine, California, Illinois, Minnesota, and Arizona of the ways public-sector unions stick it to taxpayers.
*** wouldn’t you know it, the Secretary of Labor actually used the news to push for card check and the Employee Free Choice Act
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95 Comments
Those numbers are unsustainable, an in those numbers lies the problem.
It has simply come down to "them" versus "US".
"Them" are winnin' the war of ideology.
"Labor" Unions = organized shakedown artists. Nothing more and nothing less.
Pound the Progressives into the fetal position.
Andy Stern wants a war. And why not? $60 million (that we know about) may have bought you a president Andy. But your money didn't buy you the Presidency.
Pounding you people into the fetal position is going to be as American as apple pie. Your members will turn on you. It's called human nature.
It isn't sustainable because it is not self balancing like my income and expenses every month.
The only way to fix this is to:
a. take the money out of d.c. by strangling the "revenue" side of the equation
b. legislate unions out of federal government, what do employees need to be protected from anyway? Probably me… if not a pissed off taxpayer then who?
c. Eliminate all federal departments and "services" (re: people that tell us what to do and how to live because they are experts) except military, intelligence, and a post office
A long time ago when I was working shift work in the steel mills, a young member of our crew said that he was going to switch and go work on a different shift because it was better. Another young member agreed and said he too would switch.
An old timer who happened to hear the conversation, chimed in said "hell we'll all go on that other shift".
Hell let's all go and work for the government.
They used to say in the old Soviet Union: "You pretend you are paying me and I'll pretend I am working.
I live 20 minutes outside of Atlanta where we have been deluged with people from "unionized" northern states. The vast majority of them that I have talked with are all very thankful that Georgia is a "right to work" state. I have worked in several areas over the years where I have been asked to join a union. Each time I told them to suck it. Almost every single business that was involved with unions has shut down here. The airlines are always having problems and UPS would do much better without union interference. Why have so many jobs gone overseas? UNIONS. They served their purpose but now they only tie our hands and ruin us.
Unions are nothing more than a playground ,for the rich union bosses!! You have people that retire at age 50 and get all the benefits of when they were working, for the rest of their lives??!! Are you kidding me!!? That , and the fact that the majority work for the government (US!) and WE have no say so in anything they do!!! They need to be illegal, unless, and until they can be run by people, who do not have a monetary stake in them!!
……….and we'll all get paid in Government Script, and shop at the Company Store; Walmart.
Pickle-
I agree with all, except the US postal service. The private sector can take care of that- think of UPS and Fedex competing for the privilege of delivering something for you. The postal service is a bloated, dinosaur of bureaucracy that loses money frequently.
If private sector businesses are so poorly managed as to allow conditions ripe for union organization, so be it. However, I strongly disagree with union representation of gubment funded jobs- paid for by our tax dollars. It should be illegal, at least and unconstitutional, at best.
I'm WAITING FOR THE "CASHLESS SOCIETY" to BEGIN!
"The postal service is a bloated, dinosaur of bureaucracy that loses money PERPETUALLY" . FIFY.
There goes the greeter!
and you would like to pay actual rates for sending your package or letter right? you would be the first to complain at how much it actually costs to send a letter. ups and fedex cant send at the same price as the usps its that simple. and it has nothing to do with the unions
you are getting paid in government script and you have a problem with walmart please tell us which side of the fence you are on you dont like unions but you hate walmart? what kind of an argument is that?
nice straw man argument
what?
Run along zeak.
Nothing for you to see here……..
Here's one for you zeak. We HAD a Ford plant and we HAD a GM plant. Where are they now? GONE. Why pay UAW members $20+ an hour to screw in two screws an hour when Mexicans or Canadians will do it cheaper and more efficiently?
zeak,
Don't put words in my mouth. I didn't say I don't like unions, or that I hate Walmart, you did. Truthfully, I hate unions, and don't like Walmart.
I am on my own side of the argument. Unions have done more in their time to ruin the work ethic of this country, than any one concept ever has. Walmart, in their own right, has done more to ruin the social and economic fabric of this country than any business model ever has.
Walmart is a cog, in the one world global economic picture. Junk and substandard goods are manufactured in third world cesspools, and sold in Walmart, and the cash goes back to China, completing the circle. They have done more to ruin mainstreet America, than anyone ever has.
zeak which union are you trolling for? SEIU? Teamsters?
Zeak,
The hidden costs of the USPS rates to send that letter is what's killing us. And it has everything to do with the unions.
Cowboy, You're consistently RIGHT!
The Progressives started the Unions in the first place! That is their agenda from the beginning! It's as
old as MARXISM because that's what it is all about!
Hard to believe with all the anecdotal evidence from the last century we're still having this argument!!!
Zeak- Let me make sure I understand… "pay actual rates"
1. Why would I object to willingly paying the free market rate for anything? It is my decision as to whether I choose to pay for certain goods and services out of my own pocket.
2. Why would I complain about "how much it actually costs" to send a letter when I have someone like you who sees nothing wrong with having your money (and others') redistributed so I don't have to "pay actual rates".
3. Since you interjected "it has nothing to do with the unions", I also disagree. Why should employees of a government subsidized enterprise who are supported with tax payer's funds be allowed to unionize? I resent my money being confiscated and redistributed to subsidize the union bosses.
Sorry, Zeak, I will give you benefit of the doubt and say you are naive (rather than call you ignorant).
This is a dangerous dichotomy between government and it’s host, “private business.” Now we’re being told to much tax is not enough, and as opposed to working to achieve personal success we’ll do it by the point of a gun to maintain a lumbering federal government jobs program – - where it takes six to the job of one, and needs to be told… “NO!”
If I had my druthers, I would get rid of everything that isn’t Constitutionally required, and start fresh…it’s still legal to dream, isn’t it?
i think the public employee unions and the private unions are seperate entitiys. Taxing corporations more, typical lib tax raise scheme, cuts into private employees budgets, and transfers it to public employee unions.
Zeak–let's hear your logic on the subject, not just your name calling.
Zeak knows nothing of the real world he just spews. Your overview of a “Right to Work State vs. unions” are correct.
Boeing from Washington State to South Carolina, the union killed the host. Next stop, another country.
It stinks being right.
But once one sees behind the curtain, it is right easy to see the picture clearly. Go back a few years, say to about the1990's. That was the decade in which Walmart say its greatest exponential growth. Remember Webster Hubbell, the Rose Law Firm in Little Rock, firm Partner Hillary Rhodham Clinton? They all were involved with the Board of Walmart. Granted, it didn't hurt that Mz. Clintons husband happened to be the first balck President of the United States at the time.
Walmart bloomed like a Rose, under the guidance of the Rose Law firm and the protectionist economic policies and favorable Chinese trade deals made under Bill Clinton. I had a man years ago, who was friends with a well placed exectutive at Walmart. it was great cause for celebration when Walmart had a billion dollar day. The day after Thanksgiving, Good Friday, the day after Christmas. Now, fifteen years later, Walmart is global, and every day is a billion dollar day.
Whoever ever thought it was about America, never understood economics.
Walmart, is indeed "The Company Store".
I worked for the State of New York, State of North Carolina, and State of Florida covering over 30 years! Fortunately, they didn't come into the voting booth then; but they did about everything else! In Education, I'm a history miner in college and a retired behaviorist in profession. However, I didn't get destroyed in college as most do by the progressive movement because as people that have been Americans long before the civil war, I have an "Internal Personality Type" (feel that I have control over my life. Whereas just about 100 % of Americans coming here "after" the civil war are "External Types" (feel that they ARE controlled by fate)! That is why it was against the law to emit "Roman Catholics" before the civil war (the real reason for the civil war by the way and just thank the Jesuits for that)! Oh, I'm not a racist. Also, I'm originally from North Western Connecticut, born and raised! The facts are the facts! Yes, there is a "Progressive" agenda, I'm sure!
There needs to be right to work laws in ALL states and laws passed which make it illegal for union contracts to include language that forces workers to contribute dues to a union even if they detest UNIONS!
Willie Brown, former Mayor of SF, stated this week that 80% of California's budget goes to paying for the pension plans of its employees. That's great news considering that in 2009 Governator signed a contract with its biggest Unions, SEIU(I believe) that there is to be no layoffs and no furloughs. When he reneged on the deal and laid some off, a liberal judge ruled it illegal and ordered the state to rehire and reimburse the workers. I think I'm going to call the judge to see how much he is going to chip in considering we are 20 billion short on our budget.
Not sure about the society part, but if my business doesn't improve soon, I will be cashless… literally.
Hench-
Word is zeak is a secret admirer of Bwarny Frank.
I actually included the post office only because there are provisions for it in the constitution. but I do agree with you all… USPS sucks cash and should be abolished. But not outsourced! Then we have to deal with crony capitalism and market distortion by having the feds tinkering in the market. Better to abolish and allow us to decide with our wallets whether we need snail mail or not at whatever price it costs to deliver service for profit.
Perhaps, in theory.
But a Union is still a Union. A collective bargaining unit, that collectively bargains for the benefit of the commrades. An entity existing, to protect the rights of those poor downtrodden souls, who could not hope to make it in private industry.
Try and fire a vested teacher, or Postal Worker.
Government employees should not be allowed to unionize.
Unions are supposed to be all about protecting the little guys from corporate power. Our government is not a corporation.
Straw man? Hardly.
That is the same false accusation I recently heard from mikatollah.
Is this perhaps just a troll of a different name then?
Or a Senator. Heh heh.
I think I sent like 1 letter last year. We have email, fax, scanning, etc. Brought to you by American corporations. Don't need no stinking post office. The post does not deliver my packaged and goods by and large. Yes do away with them completely.
And 4repoublic down below is exactly fucking right, I and happy to pay actual rates as we all should be. It sounds to me like it is *you* who wants to get something for nothing. Well jack you don't get something for nothing, it always has to be paid for by someone. That makes you one of the looters in my opinion.
I severely curtailed my WalMart shopping when the stores in my area discontinued their sale of firearms. Guess it was to be expected, though. They were almost all made in America! :/
It became retailer non-grata for my household when it shilled for Obamacare.
Odd. I thought everybody knew about all the unions in government. They are a major drain on local, state and federal government budgets; They're also some of the biggest $$$ sources for democrats, so don't expect them to go away easily. This is what happens when taxpayers don't pay attention. I think a lot more doses of what Massachusetts got is a good start, and if they don't start listening to their constituents I'm an advocate of tar and feathering the bastards , too!
I'd like to expand on your thoughts HarryTuttle.
Like you said, the concept of unions is to protect the employees from harsh corporate tactics. Now, the mere existence of public-sector unions implies that there are harsh government tactics. Also, it can logically lump government under the "corporation" title.
Following the liberal logic of "I hate big corporations and wall street corporate greed," wouldn't this also imply that liberals should hate big government because it would, in theory, be an extension of their hate for big business?
Liberalism clearly is a mental disorder.
If a worker believes its in his best interest to bargain collectively he should be free to…
Yes.
They should.
They should also spend their time on the job thinking about the job, and doing the job. Not standing around the break room or the water cooler, carping about management, or conspiring about how their elected commrades in the brotherhoos are working hard on their behalf, bargaining for higher pay, better benefits, and longer coffee breaks, in exchange for less work.
But what do I know?
I'm just an anti union, war mongering, conservative, capitalist robber baron.
'Been in five unions in my life. For the most part–exactly right. Outcome-based labor. Don't actually have to be good, just get paid good.
There has to be limits. What we are seeing now is that the unions are essentially an arm of the democratic party which for all practical purposes is just just an arm of the federal government. This is clearly not about protecting the worker, this is a government out of control.
There was a saying in the Soviet Union (Russians have the best sayings); "As long as they continue to pretend to pay us we will continue to pretend to work".
one of my favorite sayings. UNIONS have got to go. They had their place in time but that time is now past. Today they represent only their leaderships bloated self interest. Little has been said of late how much UNION leaders are getting paid. Villainize the CEO and ignore the money the union leaders take. UNIONS are the reason the USA is no longer competetive in manufacturing. The reason our cars don't sell. Bust the unions and get back to work, ingenuity and entreprenuers are the future. If you are set on getting work making buggy whips, then good luck to you.
Who remembers PATCO? They were the air traffic controllers union that Ron Reagan busted. We need to have someone start doing some crotch stomping on these corrupt union leaders. Unions have always been corrupt! I wonder if anything can be done to put Andy Stern in the same place they put Jimmy Hoffa? Another great example (UNIONS) of our VICTIMIZATION PIMPING PROFESSIONALS, always looking out for you by looking after themselves!!
I hate for people to be fired; however, why is it only the private sector is being fired and not the government sector.
We can start with Michelle Obama. Why does she need 22 or more assistants?
The simple fact that public sector jobs are allowed to be unionized in the first place is ridiculous, criminal, and a low down dirty shame. All unions should be run clear the hell out of the public sector, period, end of story. It should have never been allowed to happen. We need some serious union busting in this country.
I see the photo is at the U of MN in Minneapolis (the IDS and Wells Fargo towers in the background) on Washington Avenue. Figures as this city is basically a mixture of Berkeley/San Fran and Chicago mentalities.
And to further illustrate the fetid ideology of MN liberals (think Sen. Al Franken(stein)), they are cramming a light rail system no one wants down the middle of the street in a few years. Of course they don't care about threatening the hyper-sensitive research equipment in the buildings adjacent to the street, the business who don't want it, the very few people who will be super-served, or the billion dollars spent on a project which will never, ever come close to operationally breaking even.
Somehow, I bet the unions make out just fine.
Please folks let us not create a false boogie man that the Dems, Obama and the left wing are trying to do with banks and corporations.
The fact of the matter is, the collective bargaining movement has had a positive affect on our country's economic development.
Let us not get confused and lose sight of the culprits here. first and foremost, union leadership being dupped by the liberals to think that it has been the federal government that has made possible union wages and benefits. And of course, turning the federal government into the nation's largest employer (of union workers).
You've got to admit it is a perfect circle of corruption.
Did ya see the TSA story ??? Wait untill it goes UNION…. Here is the best line of the article….Thank God they stopped it so far ….
"TSA spokeswoman Suzanne Trevino said late Saturday that the employee was no longer with the agency but did not say whether he had been fired or quit, referring only to "disciplinary action" taken by the TSA. "
http://www.suntimes.com/news/nation/2008814,tsa-s...
Part 1
The reason that there are more union members in the public sector is that, beginning with Reagan, the conservative movement has done a superlative job in destroying unions in the private sector. The result is that your average private sector worker has no safety net to protect them from the depredations of the Darwinian capitalism that has transformed our democracy into a plutocracy where the top 1% of the population control 42% of the nation’s wealth and the average person is out of luck. Our multi-national corporations have relocated their operations overseas where they can exploit people who have no organized union protection thereby diminishing good private sector jobs in this country. We are left with a service economy where many private sector jobs are minimum wage service positions. The furor over pensions is understandable for those who chose the private sector to find their fortune. They actually believed in the delusional Horatio Alger stories where anyone can go from rags to riches. That scenario has an extremely low statistical probability.
Part 2For those who chose public service, their bargain was that they would take care of the disadvantaged and the poor in society for historically low wages compared to the private sector but ultimately attaining retirement security via a pension for paying their debt to society. Instead the states have consistently abdicated their fiscal duty to fund the pension system in order to avoid raising taxes! The role of government is, according to our Constitution, not only to provide for common defense but also to promote the general welfare. It also seems to me that all our great religious traditions also emphasize compassion and charity. These qualities are apparently regarded with scorn by the average conservative who believes that the private sector will provide. As Scrooge said, are there no prisons, are there no workhouses? We have squandered billions and billions in an unnecessary war in Iraq and provided enormous tax cuts and loopholes for the elite to vampirize the middle class. The sad part is that the average conservative voter is operating under the delusion that it will all some day trickle down to them! Wake up!
Government workers don't have to be productive or efficient. They are perfect for unionization.
@ CIVIL SERVANT You are trolling a lopsided view. Union dues help the Dems stay in office as Andy Stern
knows all too well. He wants to unite the world. Give me a brake.
[...] the original post: » Big Government, Big Unions – Big Government tags: being-told, constitution, federal government, jobs-program, much-tax, point, [...]
[...] this link: » Big Government, Big Unions – Big Government Share and [...]
The provision in the constitution is for the maintenance of "Post Roads" not the actual postal service itself.
This also does not mean a system of interstates, as much as I like them, there is no constitutional basis for their existence.
Just to further highlight the issue, most folks don't know that the USPS next day air is actually a function that is contracted to FedEx. The difference in pricing is being subsidized by us, the US taxpayer.
"…only 7.2 percent of workers in the private workforce have chosen to join a union."
And of that 7.2%, how many, in fact, did choose to be in a union?
The civil servant is not paid to "take care of the disadvantaged and the poor" he is paid to carry out the business of the city, county, state or federal government. Public employees, according to what I learned in Civics class many years ago, trade some part of the prevailing wage within their field at large for security within the government structure.
As far as promoting for the general welfare where did you learn that promoting and providing are synonymous.
The government providing the welfare for countless vampires has always fallen heavily on my back. I continue to work in spite of the losses I incur by doing so.
You may thank me for providing your inflated salary and the security of a government job at your leisure.
Victor, I promise I am not trolling or being purposefully obtuse here. Here goes: what is "…against the law to emit "Roman Catholics before the civil war…" (emphasis mine)
"a liberal judge" is enforcing the terms of the contract. A conservative judge would have done the same unless he was an activist. A contract is a contract.
I too share the dream.
Speaking of vampirizing (your word) the middle and all the other classes…
Do these numbers include the UAW, who gave up nothing and in fact got 17% of the company. $30 billion with no end in sight.
All of you are idiots. The public sector employees have lower level people with jobs that pay a living wage and the executives rarely make over 150,000 a year unlike private enterprises that pay the lower level employees next to nothing while the executives make millions. If all the jobs were paid like private sector jobs there would not be anyone to buy the products put out by the underpaid and more jobs would be lost. You have been sold a bill of goods by the big money makers and they are laughing themselves sick as you shoot yourselves in the foot. If you look at why unions were created in the first place, it should become obvious to your little brains what is going on. Greed caused the great depression and greed is what caused this last economic fiasco. When the executives at corporations show a little self restraint and start paying the people who keep them employed a decent wage the economy will turn around. People cannot spend what they do not have. Those executives have forgotten that it is a symbiotic relationship.
It's no wonder they added an exemption for the Unions in the Health Care Proposal. __The Progressives do have a method to their madness. Increase the Public Sector Employees & ensure continued support in Elections for the Dems. They won't vote against those holding their purse strings.__Never been a better time then the present to shrink government. __It is definitely us against them. I prefer America land of the free.
Unions and the civil service system promote mediocrity. Why try to excel when the pay is the same? Why try to do a better job when your coworkers shun you for it? No rewards and no penalties. This is why our kids can't read.
The latest Brookings Institute report (1/20/10) states that in 2008, 91.6 million people—more than 30 percent of the nation’s population—fell below 200 percent of the federal poverty level. Checks and balances are an integral part of our system to prevent abuse and excess. The government does provide succor to those in need since the rapacious capitalist system is basically survival of the fittest. According to the latest Bureau of Labor Statistics which includes salary and benefits, the professionals in the private sector make $46.82 and the professionals in the public sector make $1.12 more at $47.82. (This slightly higher rate for the public sector is not historically representative and undoubtedly reflects the corporate migration overseas). The private sector gets more salary; the public sector gets more benefits. Contrary to your insinuation, government work is actually more difficult than the private sector because you are not just thinking of yourself but must rather balance many contradictory variables. You may thank us for performing necessary public services that any civilized society should be "providing" through the taxes that you have a legal and moral obligation to pay.
What's it like sponging off the tax payer? I will bet you your pension that the people in Haiti or any other 3rd world country would give anything to be "exploited' by a corporation, that's usually the first step out of poverty, so-called sweat shops are a salvation to those people who have no other way to live. You'd rather see them living in the gutter than being gainfully employed all for "fairness". Hell, go work in a steel mill if you want to see what a true swear shop is like.
Your blather about losing factory jobs to overseas is mostly ill informed union speak anyway. What has caused the greatest job lose in the production sector is technology. It use to take 4 workers to perform a task, it now takes 1 thanks to advances in technology…unless you're union sponging off a corporation or tax payers that is.
My husband works for a private company that does a lot of work with the military. He was working in South Carolina a few months ago and ran into an old friend who was doing precisely the same work as he does, only he is a civil servant. He makes double what my husband makes.
My husband detests working on different contracts with government employees. They are lazy, if the contract says the job should be completed within 3 months, they attempt to milk the entire 3 months. It's in my husbands interest to make sure the job is done as soon as possible to cut costs, he isn't working on the tax payer dime though, but for a corporation that is in the business of making money, not soaking the tax payer.
I disagree unions are very powerful, just look at the auto industry, the unions had used there power so well to get great pay and great benefits, the downside was the cost added to the price of cars and the auto industry got obotomies, except Ford. ____Labor is one piece of the capitalist economic system, and workers should be free to organize and bargain collectively
Ah, the last resort of the ill-informed – argumentum ad hominem.
"Contrary to your insinuation, government work is actually more difficult than the private sector because you are not just thinking of yourself but must rather balance many contradictory variables."
What exactly is this supposed to mean? Please, Oh Great Civil Servant, give me one concrete example of how a job in the public sector is more difficult than the same job in the private sector.
To be honest, I think that you're trolling so I don't really expect you to be able to answer, but you never know. You might actually believe what you're saying.
Civil:
Sounds like you attended the same schools as Barack Obama and learned the same leftist propoganda about our private sector. If only you spent more time learning how to provide some service of value to other, you wouldn't be asking for a hand-out. Get off your ass an find a real job, you slacker!
Work with GOVT. Union BUE's as they are called and watch them Piss and moan about stuff that any normal (PRIVATE SECTOR) worker would be thrilled to do for the $$$ these people get paid.
Oh dear, I guess I learned it from Obama and the rest of the democrats.
Civial Servant your having an id10t issue. low paying pulbic servants $71K p/y private industry $41K. Does Andy Stern OWN SEIU, why does he get to be union King, aren't those elected offices? Your stupid agruments hold no water and hopefully you'll soon get your termination notice when we "downsize" government. After all the unions get paid from your check, which is MY MONEY, so by default I am getting the bill.
Simple rule will fix it all. No unions for Goverment workers…if you don't like it "strike" and Sarah will fire your a$$ and someone else will be glad to take your job or just eliminate it.
Buy the way I'am self employeed hope your not sitting at your government job waisting MY MONEY BLOGGING ONLINE! Barry would'nt allow that would he?
@Charles, How can you say like that? They are also good workers. Unions are there in every company.
Civil 'Servant' and Government 'Worker' are both oxymoron's. Employees of the Government almost never work nor do they serve.
I recall from the 1960's the description of the failed rocket. They called it the Civil Servant rocket because it wouldn't work and you couldn't fire it.
Some things never change, but only get worse!
We can see that part of our civil servant's problem is that civil servants don't know the difference between provide and promote. Also, I clearly sense and attitude of entitlement in your posts. You are a civil SERVANT emphasis on SERVANT. I served in the Navy for over 5 years and I never felt entitled to anything except my GI bill benefits! Unions are illegal in government anyway. You have no right to job actions and WE ARE NOT YOUR SLAVES. And since we provide the food for your table, you should have more respect for us.
Jobs have been going overseas since the 1950’s first, as part of the Marshall Plan and to Mexico in the 1960’s. Of late, jobs have gone overseas under NAFTA, GATT, and the WTO, as jobs are now considered and commodity to be bought and sold. This came about because businesses tired of regulations that made doing business, especially manufacturing, not profitable. Now, the democrats, who gave us all of these wonderful, progressive, socialist concepts, as well as these trade agreements, want to punish businesses for taking advantage of them and us? Yes, it was the progressives and democrats that gave us all of these agreements and communist agencies. And it is time for them to go.
But is the corporation not allowed to make a profit?
You cannot just say 'workers get great pay and benefits' and stop there.
Why don't we just make minimum wage $10,000 per hour and we will all be rich beyond your wildest dreams then?
Please use logic my friend.
I must confess that it is discouraging to see how close-minded and abusive the replies to my opinions are in this reactionary echo chamber. I’ll try to put it in the best light by attributing it to the fear you are experiencing after 30 years of conservative control have bankrupted our country morally, economically, and politically. It must frighten you all to realize that the best efforts of the conservative movement have only led to our country’s decline. Obama or anyone else will not solve it in one year or many years when so much denial and obstruction is being promulgated by the extreme right. Nevertheless, I hope that we all find a way to bridge our differences and find solutions for our country.
I'll bridge it with my votes in '10 and '12. That will close the gaps.
Seeing as how you also pay taxes, your statements show a disturbing lack of self-respect.
And you keep ignoring the unmitigated disaster unleashed upon America by your Obamessiah and the Apostates.
Zeak, what do you mean what? I believe she spelled out the point she was trying to make. If you don't agree with it, then give a reason why and back it up with either a strong fact based opinion or at the least give some party line speaking points!!
I must tell you that I come from a union family. My grandfather walked the picket lines in the 1930’s at ford motor co. to gain job rights and protections that everyone now gets as a matter of law. However, that was then. Since that time, unions have “lost their way”. Then, workers’ rights, safety concerns, child labor, equitable compensation, job security, and pensions have all given way to money, money, money. This is because a labor union is a business. Its’ product is the skills of the people it represents. As a business, they need to show a profit to be successful. Also, the union bosses at the top are making a fortune, that they have learned how to hide just like the so-called rich have.
i work for a major company, whose chief competitor has a unionized work force, and i may as well add, the company dominates the industry they are in.
I know people that work for "that" company, who do the exact same job i do. I know how much "work" they do on average.
I do approximately 2.5 Times as much work daily, as they do each day, yet they make 2 times as much as i do, daily. I am starving and work 2 jobs because my 1st job (non-union) which takes me about 55-60 hours a week to do, brings home so little. And now they are talking about cutting our pay rate, because the economy is hurting their business…hurting their business? They spend 100's of millions a year on advertising wholly unnecessary because their company is a household name and almost synonymous with the industry they are in, and meanwhile at the exact same time they are raising prices.
They, the company i work for, are capitalizing on the current political atmosphere regarding unions and organized labor (as i said, their number one competitor, and ahead of them, is organized) by being the exact type of company for which unions came into existence, and yet the government, and the public in general (in ignorance) completely support them.
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